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WN_Controller 6 axis 10 bits + 36 buttons with PIC18F2455

Discussion in 'DIY peripherals' started by willynovi, Nov 4, 2009.

  1. tirta

    tirta Member

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    Hi Sokol1,

    Thanks for the explanation.

    This one is similar to willynovi design.
    Does it also eliminate noise like noalone?
    I do not see the the pull down resistors.
    For hall sensor use, do you think it is better with pull down resistors for eliminating noise?

    And do I still need the bootloader?
    I have read some of the posts here:
    http://www.xtremeracers.info/forums/vie ... cdaf0daf60
    that says bootloader is no longer needed.
    Is it true?
    Please advise.
  2. Sokol1

    Sokol1 Member

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    Tirta,

    The Willynovie layout PCB has additional components - over Nohalone layout - due bootloader use, that allow him - as developer - experiment with different firmware versions.

    In case Willynovie put the pull-up resistors in PCB of keymatrix board.

    For all I know Noalone have some electronic knowledge - and previous experience with Mjoy, see Crobol post in last pages - then he can simplified the layout by eliminating related bootloader components. I ask him about the double layer (two-side) PCB use and he answer:

    si sokol, es a doble cara, sobre todo para eliminar ruido. ~ Yes Sokol, is double face, especially to eliminate noise.

    The same as Servio said about the changes in Mjoy. :thbup:

    I am only a hobbyist without electronic knowledge, I am not able to argue about this details. :blush:

    Additionally Noalone put pull-up resistors in Joy.01 board (instead leave in keymatrix board) - more logical solution, since in some cases (like joystick rewire) keymatrix board is not need/desirable.

    Inf fact even the LED and associated resistor in Noalone layout is not necessary and can safety eliminated.
    Is only for show that Joy.01 is power on, but if you put the board inside a joystick box is not visible.
    Obvious if desire, you can put a two pin connection for LED extension cable (or just solder cable in original LED positions), and put the LED in joystick box wall. :brows:

    Eventually I build a Joy.01 - but since I have 6 Mjoys8/16 and 2 L.Bodnar BU0836 laying around... :D

    Sokol1
  3. tirta

    tirta Member

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    Hi Sokol1,

    You are too modest, for me you are the most knowledgeable person about diy hotas on the planet, period.
    You are like an encyclopedia, you know everything, man. thumbs2
    :cheerleader:

    I think I am going to try making noalone version.

    but I would like to edit the pcb file,
    so that the usb is facing the top section and eliminate the led + resistor.
    what program should use?

    And how many Ohm are the pull down resistors?
    I can not find this on the english manual.

    Do you have the component list for noalone?
    It seems that he use less component,
    only 3 type of capasitors, do you know what are they?

    I want to use this joy.01 together with mjoy16,
    I hope there will not be a problem,
    what do you think?
    maybe put the 4 main axis in joy.01 and let all the button in mjoy16?

    I plan to change all the single button in my hotas with 4+1 directional button,
    there are 5 on pro throttle= 5x5 = 25 + remaining 3x4 = 12, total = 37
    and on combatstick 5x2 + remaining 2x4 +4, total = 22
    so 37 + 22 = 59 buttons.
    using noalone 4 axis, I get 64 buttons, so it will be enough.

    However, I am still short of 2 axis for toe brakes in the pedal,
    so I still need the mj16.
    or should I build the 6 axis version? but still there is not enough button,
    I still need to usethe mj16.
    What do you think? which one is better?
  4. Sokol1

    Sokol1 Member

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    Hi Tirta,

    I dont see problem in use Joy.01 and Mjoy16 in the same computer - probable you need change Mjoy16 vendor ID to high number. In case use Mjoy16 for Throttle an Pedal.


    If you dont find double side PCB foil try this single layout for Joy.01 (Nohalone) 4 axis/64 buttons:

    [​IMG]

    With USB connector in L the height of board is 33mm.

    The best is you drawn PCB accord you need. Try with Express PCB, that allow 3D view:

    http://www.expresspcb.com/

    Read this tips:

    http://www.expresspcb.com/ExpressPCBHtm/Tips.htm

    Sokol1
  5. GeorgeBoles

    GeorgeBoles Member

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    Hi, Tirta and Sokol.

    I have a successfully built MJoy16 and I am pleased with it.

    BUT now that you have mentioned it, I can see that the response is slower than I would have liked especially with the machine gun trigger (Button 01). (I do not know if it is because I use SVMapper and Autokey to help map things around or whether it is a USB1.1 vs 2.0 thing. )

    But if Controlodora and Noalone's sticks are quicker, then why not build two of these? This would be more efficient than building one Willynovi/Noalone and one MJoy 16. (You only have to design one PCB and think about wiring up one type of board .)

    Tirta, how many axes do you need?

    I count:
    X, Y, Throttle, Rudder (4)
    Mixture, Prop (fine/course)/ (ignition advance would take the place of Prop in WWI) (2);
    Toe brakes (2).

    This comes to eight, which is easily covered by two 6 axis Controlodora's or by two Noalone's 4 axes systems.

    If flying multi engine, then you could use still another three axes and still be under 12 ... (I do not know if any sims allow ANALOLGUE control of the prop, mixture, ignition settings for EACH engine?)

    And then ensure that you have your machine guns and cannons mapped to one of the Controladoras to keep things as quick as possible.

    Perhaps I have misunderstood what you want, but something to think about.

    Just wondering,

    Regards,
    George.
  6. GeorgeBoles

    GeorgeBoles Member

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    Well, Chaps.

    I am glad I am not a B-17 pilot (the Mighty Eighth):

    X, Y, Rudder (3)
    Toe brakes (2)
    Throttle, Pitch, Boost, Mixture for each engine (16 axes for a four engine bomber)

    That only comes to 21 axes!!

    I am sure there are more, but I don't know about them.

    Regards,
    George
    :)
  7. tirta

    tirta Member

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    Hi George and Sokol1,

    since I fly mainly modern jets and helicopter,
    I only need 6 axis and 59 buttons.
    I think that is enough for now. :D

    and like you, George, I have made an mj16 last year, and yes, it works very well,
    until Sokol1 told me that there is a faster controller. ;P

    Sokol1, thanks for the pcb design.
    However, I have already made noalone version using 2 pcb:
    one side for top side, another one for the bottom side, then glue it together,
    what do you think? will it work?
  8. Sokol1

    Sokol1 Member

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    Tirta,

    If pin 20 of IC support pass trough the two PCB's no problem - is the only that need to be solder in opposing side.

    Another components (resitor, capacitor, crystal) have long legs.

    Sokol1
  9. tirta

    tirta Member

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    Hi Sokol1,

    thanks for the explanation. :D
    right now I am waiting for PIC 18F2550.
    finally, I got it cheap from ebay, :thbup:
    but I have to wait for about 2 weeks for the shipment to reach me.

    I am still not very clear about the programming,
    I am using your JDM2 here:
    http://www.diylife.com/2008/02/15/progr ... ontroller/
    I have to connect from
    Jdm2 to PIC18F2550:
    vpp > pin no. 1
    vdd > pin no. 20
    vss > pin no. 19 or 8
    clk > pin no. 27
    dat > pin no. 28
    Is this right?
    for vss, , do I need to use both 8 and 19? or one is enough?

    For programming, do I need the PIC18F inside the PCB? or connect straight from the jdm2 to PIC18F2550?
    Please advise.
  10. willynovi

    willynovi Member

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    connect JDM to 18F2550 directly.

    hey, thank to Sokol1 for all yours post ;)
  11. tirta

    tirta Member

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    willynovi and sokol1,

    winpic800 can not detect the jdm2 programmer.
    I have check and recheck the pcb and the components, but I can not find any error.
    Someone here has experience with this kind of programmer?
    please help.
  12. tirta

    tirta Member

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    here are some pictures of the jdm2:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
  13. dj dicksy

    dj dicksy New Member

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    2.ZIP 1.ZIP For all those who have little problems programing the 2455 or 2550 try to use this type of programmer.For programming i use PICPgm - PIC Development Programmerar which is a software very easy to use.I hope i help you all with this little advice
    http://members.aon.at/electronics/pic/picpgm/

    Attached Files:

    • 3.ZIP
      File size:
      196.5 KB
      Views:
      428
    • 4.ZIP
      File size:
      154.2 KB
      Views:
      431
  14. Jadran

    Jadran Member

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    http://www.sendspace.com/file/49ibwi does not work!

    Here's the other link: https://rapidshare.com/files/766303299/ ... lynovi.rar
  15. kubing

    kubing Member

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    [​IMG]

    work for me
  16. tirta

    tirta Member

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    I thought this forum was closed since I could not access it,
    it seems there is something wrong with my bookmark:
    www.x-simulator.de/forum/wn-controller- ... a704b369a9
    or maybe the forum address is changed????
    Anyway, thank God finally I find it again. :D

    @dj dicksy
    I have downloaded all your attachments, but I can not find the component list,
    where is it?
  17. dj dicksy

    dj dicksy New Member

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  18. tirta

    tirta Member

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  19. dj dicksy

    dj dicksy New Member

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  20. tirta

    tirta Member

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    Hi Guys,

    Finally I find the culprit.
    It is my BIOS setting, the serial port was not connected yet.
    Now after I fix it, my jdm2 is detected
    and I can program my PIC18F2550 successfully with no error with it.

    I use noalone version with
    MCHPUSB_Joystick_01_4ejes_64botones.hex from Willynovi_Controladora_USB_10bits.rar
    The programming went successfull with no error.

    However, I have another problem now:
    when I plug Joy.01 into my computer,
    my windows xp can not detect it,
    I get device unknown instead.

    Do you know why?
    What do I have to do now?
    Please advice.
    Thanks.