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Tronic's AMC motor motion-controller with pwm/servo output

Discussion in 'SimTools compatible interfaces' started by tronicgr, Aug 30, 2007.

  1. Gianni

    Gianni New Member

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    My Motion Simulator:
    DC motor, 4DOF
    I have tested the unit with all components disconnected, same results. Eventually took all Mosfet off, tested one by one (used the simple mosfet tester) and found on IRF3205 leacking, checked all diodes, found one ZN15V behaving strange (different bank), replaced all, tested these again ... whaoh! all working over 11 volts output ..
    Connected the 2 motors, voltage dropped... remove the suppressing capacitors and voila' all back to normal with reduced humming noice. Tested the motor for leacks.. no leaks! Installed just the centre suppressor (between the 2 wires) all ok.. No drop of voltage noticable from the power battery and humming improved.
    Now comes the fun.. installed the heat sinks on the mosfet (with steel spacers).... back to 4-5 volts... removed the heat sink .. back to 11 volts...
    Also, I did remove the fan connection from the AVR voltage regulator connection, just to bust up power to drive the 74H08, this did help slightly
    Next chance, time allowing, will be to install independent heat sinks and the fan to the power battery and test again.. if problem persist, will get a set of the IRLZ44..
    Thanks for your support and advises.
  2. wimpo`

    wimpo` Member

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    hello i have a question about the part list and pcb's.
    Is the parts list in the first post still accurate because then i will order them.
    http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/download/file.php?id=616
    And i have here an amc pcb v1.5b
    [img600px]http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/download/file.php?id=4&mode=view/AVRmotionsimulatorcontroller1_5b_photo.gif[/img600px]
    will it work?
    The same question is about the dual simple mosfet h-bridge v1.2b pcb is this also still good enough.
    [img600px]http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/download/file.php?id=325&mode=view/dual_simple_hbridge_1_2b_photo.gif[/img600px]
    And is the DSMhB part list also still accurate.
    http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/download/file.php?id=329

    Thanks
  3. Frakk

    Frakk Active Member

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    Read the last 10-15 posts.
  4. wimpo`

    wimpo` Member

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    I've read the last 50+ posts and I already read the first 50+ pages once.
    What I'm asking is, that if there is a parts list for both pcb's with good documentation about how to build the boards, Program the amc and connect it to sim profiler.
    you know like that it will work the first time and not after 20-+ times of trying and reading 70 pages of useless information before you get any idea of how it's so pose to work, and still end up with nothing.
    It's really frustrating for someone who just wants a simple motion simulator for racing or flying, Without having to learn about capacitors and crystals an what not.
    I'm willing to give it another try because i really want a motion simulator, I'm just hoping that there is a moderator or admin who can just set this mess straight.
    for example just for a much cleaner way of this great diy community project.
    topic for
    AMC parts and ordering With a complete first post only about the parts, shops, etc.
    Building the amc With a complete first post only about how to build the amc soldering order good pics etc.
    Programming the amc With a complete first post only about programming it, hardware connections and software settings.
    general question amc With afirst post faq and helpdesk members.
    DSMhB parts and ordering With a complete first post only about the parts, shops, etc.
    Building the DSMhB With a complete first post only about how to build the DSMhB soldering order good pics maybe a movie etc.
    General question DSMhB With a faq and helpdesk members.

    This way it's easier for new members to join a community.
    The information is available i know but it's scattered all over the place, and nowhere a concrete answer to be found.
    I think for a stable community project that tries to produce stable hardware and software, you should simplify things for the followers and give tasks to the sim dev team to make it as accessible and stable for the community to grow, there are now only a handful of developers that are doing amazing things but I can't follow them it's just not in my capability. :blush: . But I'm sure that there are some people out there ho want in on this but don,t want to cut the forest before they can see the trees.

    It's just al this information cramped in one topic is simply unnecessary,I think it's about time it splitted up in different topics or just create a sub-forum just for the AMC an DSMhB whit the topics.
    I hope to god that you will not see this as a rant but more as a suggestion.
    just my 2 cents

    Thanks
  5. Frakk

    Frakk Active Member

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    Here are my 2 cents:

    -Nobody is getting payed to organize hundreds of forum pages and summarize projects. No one has the time to write step-by-step instructions on how to make PCB's and how to solder, while teaching you about electronics (you can actually find everything you want to know on google). Whatever information is available on these DIY projects on the forum is the product of everyone's free time, and not their job.

    -you know like that it will work the first time and not after 20-+ times of trying and reading 70 pages of useless information before you get any idea of how it's so pose to work, and still end up with nothing.
    If you cannot handle this, buy a complete system and forget building your own. I think it is obvious that you will need some background knowledge about electronics before you start building any... If it makes you feel better I read 300page datasheets on a single component before I decide to use it. I know, it is a lot easier to follow simple instructions.

    -The AMC and DSMhb already have their own threads. What is the point in splitting it up? Just so the information can be more scattered?

    -The first post of these threads already have what you are asking for. Thanos spent a lot of time on documentation just for people like you so check that out. Besides, the first post can only be edited by the poster, in this case tronicgr. If you would read my post on the top of this thread, you would know I have already suggested keeping the parts list up to date.


    The bottom line is:
    -Don't expect to build a simulator without any background knowledge, counting on people to do it for you. You have to spend the time to read and educate yourself.
    -If you really need all this information summarized, why don't you do it? Everyone would appreciate it and you might end up learning in the process.
    -Information presented on the forum is free. You could pay for instructional pdf's, parts lists, and pcb plans, but you don't.

    And don't see this as a rant either, just my opinion.
  6. R-eng

    R-eng Member

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    Unfortunately it does come off as a rant...an arrogant one at that.

    I for one had no problems following this post/thread and building fully functioning AMC/DSMhb modules. Maybe you should read the first 50+ pages again so that something actually sinks in.

    In Tronic's first page sticky, the second to last link does just this as you suggest!

    And in his final link he points to 4 very good video demos.

    Otherwise...just move on.

    R-eng
  7. wimpo`

    wimpo` Member

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    well i can't help it if you will see this as a rant but to call it a community project you should have some structure in it,
    Stable version and beta version.
    i'm not saying that my way is the way to go but to say that i'm completely wrong is just short minded.
    This topic is 99 pages! ridiculous that the information i need is on 1, 22, 69,75 for example.

    This is maybe one of the best examples from you frakk. You saw my suggestion as an attack but, you want about the same thing.
    As you point out that the same question pops out to many times when it can be answered in the first post.

    My give in this is that i would be more than willing to document everything for everyone with some help.
    but i'm also willing to donate to this forum so you could be payed for the documentation al simple rules of a community I think.
    Just show me the **** donate button.
    I will start the documentation this afternoon.
    And i'm sorry that i maybe offended some of you guys, but i am familiar with some great community's (php forums and Photoshop forums).

    Again sorry
  8. Frakk

    Frakk Active Member

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    I personally wasn't offended, I understand your frustration.

    I think tronic's first posts are a great start to build both of his circuits and he did a great job with instructions. It would be plenty enough if you can just expand that information with whatever you think is missing, no point rewriting it. That could be FAQ, important information that is missing and updated parts. I'm sure if you collect all this information and send it to Thanos he will be kind enough to edit the post and paste whatever is missing.
  9. wimpo`

    wimpo` Member

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    that was sort off my point.
    It's been i think a year since the last time I tried to build the amc1.5.
    That failed hopelessly, since than I just haven't had the time to build it education personal stuff etc..
    But now i wanted to try and build it again, but I have seen that the information is about the same since the last time.
    Only more pages and al little tweak here en there.
    So I was assuming that the amc1.5 was a stable product.
    And that i could follow the first post and build it, but i wasn't sure about my pcb's and the first post parts list.
    After i asked i got the answer read the last 10 - 15 posts, That made me a little bit nerves about trying it again and hoping i got the information right this time.
    So that is why I tried (maybe a little bit to aggressive) to come with a solution not only for me but also for the future followers.
    Assuming that those people are like me, not completely stupid but to far behind on the simplest things like soldering and electronics knowledge.
    i'm not saying that there should be a electronics kit or something like that, more a step by step plan keeping in mind that some people like the journey and some like me, like the finish.

    but i have to start over anyway, so i will with the approval from you guys document my building of the amc1.5 and DSMhB1.2 step by step with pictures.
    I only hope that there will be some pointers so that i'm not setting others up for failure.
  10. Frakk

    Frakk Active Member

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    The AMC is not a product and neither it is stable. I couldn't get it working reliably, and there are a lot components on the board that are not needed due to the lack of firmware and board design. It is pretty much the first of its kind and there are a lot of room for improvements. I could probably make a functionally same circuit that is a third in size and about half the component count but I neither have the time or money to make anything.

    Because this is the only available controller in this price range, I couldn't recommend anything else, but something is has to come out at one point in time if you are patient.
  11. pathetic

    pathetic Member

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    Finally i have finished my h-bridge. They are both working well. I am still using AMC board to drive them but i am also writing some code to use with PIC18f4550. Communication can be done by usart or usb interface. I can use both of them.
    I have some diffucilties with PI control. maybe i can get help from you Frakk if you want.

    tigsim.
  12. Frakk

    Frakk Active Member

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    There is already plenty of information available on PID controllers that will explain it much better than I can ever do. I bet if you look on Microchip's you will find a couple application notes with sample code too.
  13. sterex

    sterex New Member

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    Hello! I was wondering if i could make a motor control board with arduino. if anyone has a thought about this, please feel free
    to discuss. Because I think I am going to take this arduino path to save me some time and money in order to get my sim running.
    I am from the little island nation the Maldives and its not easy to get components here. But its not hard to order an arduino kit
    from a nearby country like india or singapore.
  14. sterex

    sterex New Member

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    Tronic's motor controller looks great and i would love and enjoy tinkering with it , assembling the parts and you know.. if only i could get those components. lol. especially microchips like those.
  15. tronicgr

    tronicgr

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    I think its possible, but you need to sit and program it yourself...
    Look here: http://www.ladyada.net/make/mshield/use.html


    Thanos
  16. willynovi

    willynovi New Member

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    hi, I´m working on a board based on 18F2455 series, firmware works with 18F4550 too.
    I use CDC mode for comunication with PC, it´s a RS232 emulation and works like a COM port in X-Sim. I make some test, like sending to axis values and it works fine.

    Right now, I´m building an H bridge board based on L298 chip to control a DC motor for my DIY FFB steering wheel, next I´ll start programming some code for controller it with current sense feedback loop.

    If you want, start a new topic.
  17. sterex

    sterex New Member

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    hello again guys! i've been once again searching for an alternative and might be cheaper ways for a controller. Today I did a bit looking into this Geckodrive which looks promising. It's for like a $114 bucks or so.. Does anyone outhere think that this could work out as an interface? you know like, for people who wants to finish building the sim in less time and possibly with less experience in electronics.
    I am thinking when it comes to making your own controller or even building the AMC motor controller not everyone of us has the priviledge of a nearby corner store which sells components ( which includes myself ). Even if they did, probably the overhead cost will grow beyond our budget. which means we either have to spend more time for the fund which means our dream of building a sim and riding it moves further away which means heart breaking.
    I hope someone who knows better, give a thought about this and let us know.
    Your most valued thoughts are appreciated. Thanks a lot.
  18. sterex

    sterex New Member

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    Thanks Thanos! for the link. So I think its doable. I might be taking that road soon. I'll share with all of you, of my work after I get my Arduino board. If this works it will be great. I hope this works.
  19. tronicgr

    tronicgr

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    One possible arduino board that seems ideal for motion control is this:
    http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/produc ... ts_id=9152

    Arduino Mega... :yes:

    If I had the resources to buy something like that, I would give it a try! :cheers:


    Thanos
  20. RaceRay

    RaceRay Administrator Staff Member SimAxe Beta Tester

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    My Motion Simulator:
    2DOF, DC motor, SimAxe, SimforceGT
    @sterex: please open a new thread when you are looking for a alternative to Thanos AMC interface.

    Thanks, RaceRay