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RBR plugin retraction

Discussion in 'Off Topic - All other stuff here' started by FAG, Sep 23, 2009.

  1. bvillersjr

    bvillersjr Active Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    Yes, this is great news. Thanks!!

    However, he asked me to remove his name from my post, so I simply complied with his request.

    I'm glad to hear that this will be in the next release.
  2. avaisane

    avaisane New Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    Wonderfull news, thanks FAG
  3. FAG

    FAG New Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    Friends, it is not necessary to thank me. Yes I really sent data to sirnoname. And when has conceded the rights to Frex, has asked not to include plugin in the distribution kit.

    Can abuse me, I can make only apologies X-Sim to community.
  4. MasterYoda

    MasterYoda Active Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    I am sorry mate, I am not sure I understood you...

    Are you saying that you did in fact sold your plugin to Frex, or not?

    Cheers,

    MY
  5. FAG

    FAG New Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    Yes, I have sold the information of reception GForce data from RBR.
  6. CXCSimulations

    CXCSimulations Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    That's interesting. Well, I can only say congratulations. I have no problem with that at all. If you created it, then you can sell it to another (for profit) company.

    I think it's even better that you donated it to the X-Sim community as well. To be honest, I hope you can continue to do this for more titles. It means there will be more titles on motion simulators and hopefully some of those go to X-sim as well.

    Thanks a lot for this!
  7. MasterYoda

    MasterYoda Active Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?


    Well, I hope it was simple like that... From what he explained above, he asked Sirnoname to not use his plugin and Bernard to remove his name (and denied a copy of the plugin) after selling the thing to Frex!
    As far as I understand this could be a condition Frex imposed on him to buy his stuff.

    FAG, could you clarify that? :?


    I always suspected these suckers from Frex are sneaking around this forum looking for information to implement new games/features on that piece of shit they call control software! This seems to have happened with Dirt/Grid and now they are doing worse with RBR...

    Their software is simply pathetic, if they were a little smarter they would simply stop doing that crap and just recommend their customers to use x-Sim!
    It would make their product simpler and more attractive!

    They suck such a big time they are not able to develop their software by themselves! :thbd:


    Cheers,

    MY
  8. FAG

    FAG New Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    It is the truth.

    Abuse me, but on the other hand our community too uses ideas from Frex, I think at many the design similar Frex is collected.

    :cheers:

    PS
    For myself I have decided, that more than the such would not repeat, further not to transfer the absolute copyrights.
  9. MasterYoda

    MasterYoda Active Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    No worries FAG!

    Thanks for clarifying the matter. :thbup:

    Although, the best scenario would be the one described by Chris, you sell to Frex and donate to x-Sim... It may be something you can think about next time! Since, I understand you may have been able to develop this plugin by using info from this forum and help from Sirnoname and other users.

    About your comment on copying Frex ideas, this is completely not true. The moving seat idea is out there much before Frex existed, they just copied and applied to their product. The only thing we learned from Frex were all flaws and mistakes from their design, how to NOT make a control software, and how to piss your clients off with the crappiest customer service in the world! :thbd:

    Take care!
  10. FAG

    FAG New Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    At me very much wide experience in creation of the software which to me allows to create that that is necessary to me, without assistance. Though the help never I refuse, and sincerely I ask it when it is required to me.
  11. MasterYoda

    MasterYoda Active Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    I am sure about that, Fag!

    Good for you, Fag!

    That is a problem I see in the market today, Fag... Russians have a good potential, technically speaking, but they sell their bodies out way too cheap, Fag! :(

    Cheers,

    MY
  12. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    I guess we'd appreciate that.
  13. Fahim

    Fahim Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    Master Yoda, well this was and still is a friendly community but when something gets good , you get commericial people joining and wanting to use the ideas for money making. That's life. It happens in all industry.
  14. CXCSimulations

    CXCSimulations Member

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    Re: Richard Burns Rally motion?

    I have to disagree there - respectfully :) I see a lot of Frex originated designs and or concepts in the user created simulators here. Heck, I see a lot of our stuff here as well. As long as it's for personal use and not turned into a commercial product (ie someone uses my designs to make money) I don't really see a problem with it. Imitation is the ultimate form of flattery.

    I think this community is fantastic. It breeds ingenuity in the purest sense of cloud sourcing. It continuously pushes me to innovate in my company, why can't it work the other way as well?

    As for FAG's situation, I say more power to him! As long as he's not directly selling open source intellectual property, he should be rewarded for his hard work in finding that data. If he donates the results to the community as well, then Fantastic! If not, oh well, but it's his prerogative.

    I liken what he did to me creating a fantastic novel using OpenOffice and selling that novel. Yes, I did use the open-source software to create the novel, but the product I sold was the novel, not the software.



    It seems to me that there a few around here that have some rather ugly feelings toward some for-profit companies. I can understand if that is because they don't agree with the way they their business. I just hope this is not globally applied to all commercial project. I would hope nobody here feels that way about me or my company because we do this for a living :)

    As I tried to convey above, I think both the for-profit companies and the users here can not only coexist here, but really assist each other.

    I think the (changed) title of this thread sends the wrong message personally, but that maybe because I'm a little biased being on the commercial side.
  15. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    I agree with you basically.
    But selling the exclusive copyright for a plugin which had been released to the XSim commnity before, wasnt that fortunate.
    Personally I have no problem with someone going the commercial way. But this particular circumstace is a little sad Imho, as he did send the plugin to Sirnoname for implementation in the next XSim release, and posted it here in the forum, already^^

    There are no ugly feelings, as long as commercial sales talks keep outside the private XSim forum. This wasnt the case here...just to speak generally.

    I am open for suggestions.
    Btw, just this splitted off part of the original thread got renamed. The topic title of the original non-commercial thread kept the same.
    richard-burns-rally-motion-t959.html
  16. bvillersjr

    bvillersjr Active Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    By nature, eveyone will side with their own interests.

    I'm sure that Chris (CXC) is pleased to have been rescued from the typical slow to market Frex game support and would encourage X-Sim to help Frex along in any way possible.

    From my own perspective, being based on X-Sim, I would rather see more X-Sim exclusives. As a community, we've taken great pride in devloping a superior solution and we don't necessarily care to see Frex benefit from this effort.

    However, as it has been stated earlier, it is FAG's perogitive to determine who will benefit from his efforts.

    The thing that I find most interesting about this conversation however is that memory locations cannnot be copyrighted, patented or otherwise protected in any way AFAIK. Anyone who buys a list of memory locations and believes that it is exclusive is a bit foolish.

    On the other hand, the plugin that reads this information is definitely a protectable work or compilation and can be sold exclusively. However, the Frex and X-Sim software architectures do not have a common plugin schema! Any work compiled for Frex is a seperate work than one that would be compiled for X-Sim.

    I think FAG could legally provide exclusive works for both, although I would encourage him to become an X-Sim contributor and develop the same sense of loyalty to it that many of the rest of us have.

    :cheers:
  17. CXCSimulations

    CXCSimulations Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    I see. So the real sore issue here is the initial release, then retraction of the plugin later. Not the fact that it was ever sold to begin with.

    I can understand everybody's general let down then.

    I think he see's the error in this as well. It seems he's not willing to offer exclusivity anymore anyhow. To me, I read that as I tried this, it didn't work out too well, so I'm going to do it differently from now on. I can understand and relate with that.

    Ok, very fair. I'm not really sure how it wasn't the case here though. He tried to keep it out of the forums as much as possible it seemed to me.

    Hmm..... How about RBR Plugin Retraction? Sellout has such a negative connotation in our language (granted, so does his user name!). I just don't want him to be turned off this forum because of this. It seems he has so much to offer this community and is still willing to offer it. He's been very honest and open about his dealings and that should be noted. So is his position on future dealings.

    Anyhow, this is all purely my input as an individual X-Sim fan. I'd really like to hear what others think as well to make sure I'm not way off base.
  18. MasterYoda

    MasterYoda Active Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    I believe the mess started with my gut feeling that the information had been sold to Frex...
    Until that point, he hadn't explained the situation here. As far as I understood, he just asked Bernard to take his name of a post!

    It could have been a much softer discussion if he had just came to the forum and explained he was selling the plugin to Frex and would not support it anymore here due to contract restrictions with that co.

    Actually, I believe it got ugly when he tried to justify himself.
    He should just let it go... Not say he doesn't need anybody to develop the stuff, that we all copy frex design (that actually Frex copied from somebody else), just because it is the most widely known design, it does not mean it belongs to them.

    As a matter of fact, if that was so good CXC would not make so many changes, too.
    And, you Chris already complained about Frex to me in the past...

    I am not upset with FAG, I am mad at Frex to impose such stupid restriction which probably was accepted by FAG due to his innocence and lack of experience on this sort of thing. As Bernard explained, there is no way they could make a memory offset mapping proprietary...
    If for some reason FAG sent all his maps in private to Sirnoname or somebody else, nobody would ever know, as this can be figured out with some lucky, hard work and freeware software available out there! Frex would never be able to tell anything about that!

    This just proves that in the end, Frex is just a bunch of faggots... Lol
    Sorry, couldn't resist! ;-)

    Cheers,

    MY
  19. MasterYoda

    MasterYoda Active Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    Agreed... But, if we all don't try to protect this place from those intentions, what will remain in the end?

    If x-Sim was to be a commercial product, it could have been for a long time already, since it is far superior than anything out there!
    I just believe some people here don't give the right value to x-Sim... Perhaps, few believe they can make something like that... However, these people would never be able to make anything like that because they lack attitude!

    Cheers to x-Sim!
    :cheers:
  20. FAG

    FAG New Member

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    Re: FAG RBR plugin sellout

    Once I sold the plugin, I PM informed about this sirnoname it was 09.03.2010, bvillersjr porosil removed my name 29.03.2010, nowhere's unity, and only then when I was not deserved praise all had to talk to the audience. Prior to this plugin is 4 months was at the Forum in beta test, and who wanted the downloaded. All your questions I answered honestly, though their ignorrirovat.
    In short everything that I wanted to say I have already said.