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Questions - Help - 3DOF AC Platform IT Begins -

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Building Q&A / FAQ' started by cthiggin, Feb 16, 2014.

  1. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    Hi friends,
    Boy oh Boy - Seems like "me" really have started something "Good" -

    @speedy - Have all the respect in you and your recommendations - so, we are BACK to the SimAx board - and as you say, it's a twin to the SimAx Software - and I will have tremendous support ! That's Good.

    @BlazinH - Wow, you always write very comprehensive and reasoning/recommendations as to how to make the already Good - to a GREAT Product....
    Of course, I have no clue as to PID's, picax, Code (0) - I do understand that 64Bit is exponentially so much faster that 8Bit in data exchange. - PS - I already have the Digital Pots, 5v.

    So, in summation - I challenge the "heavy-weights" here, and I've listed their names before - GET TOGETHER, and make the SimAx just GREAT! The BEST one we can get!
    I have waited 3 years to get started on my build, and if I have to wait a little longer to get the BEST Sim-Ax Board - I can do that without any reservation.

    I highly appreciate you all and thank you for taking the time to get involved...........this will NOT ONLY help ol'Tom, but the future of our involvements / forum / and , as a whole, what we have to offer.

    ALL of you have a most blessed one,

    Tom
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2014
  2. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    Rascal it is ... with a lot of hammering will be flattened ... with soft edges .
    • Like Like x 1
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2014
  3. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    Hi friend Speedy,
    You SAID it ALL - just a "perfect" use of RASCAL!!!!!!!!!

    Have a blessed one you and all.

    Tom
  4. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    @BlazinH ... Unless you're "wanted" or copied your project and afraid of sharing it ... OR your teacher back in the Navy told you not to open your mouth in class so you think it is "Classified "... that is something else !!

    You stated before that you posted your project to convince/impress professionals here with your work ... So they can trust your words/advice ... that is a good strategy to be heard and respected ... that's what life is about ... and that's there right to keep it clean and informative here ...

    But with error in application in your side ... you don't share what you have in your expertise in case it is yours/prove it ... you just keep coming up with distraction/comparisons/changing subject ... all kind of things that made me ofter few posts find you -10 of 10 ...
    You are a BLACK HOLE ... Although you have a sharp vision and can support with detailed information ... 3 pages at least .

    But I can see also that you don't know the concept of communication in the digital world ... that's where not only com ports communicate ... but Humans too .

    So Let me share this black matter with you ... Not answering my questions may subject you to be MY first one to put in my ignorance list ... that includes further answers form you to others will be neglected ... Such action is/will spreading again and I'm afraid soon you'll be separated from the community more ... with more posts like this one from others ... I guess you Enjoy that ... which indeed not your aim !!

    Rephrasing the questions again ... If you might like ...
    what type of controller you'd like using in your experience ? why ?
    Do you think that Saberthooth can drive AC motors ? why ?

    regards ...
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2014
  5. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    Hi Folks,
    Have an electrical question?
    I have my mechanical build just about finished, and starting with the electrical.

    QUESTION: I would like to "encase" my 230V 3phase supply line (to my gearhead motors) & my pot cable TOGETHER, for sake of neatness. Will this concept have any interference by the two cables
    being together and touching. I am using standard 14/3 w/ground shielded wire and hi-end encased telephone cable for the pots?

    Your help would be most appreciated.

    Have a blessed one.

    Tom
  6. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Hi Tom, There’s always a possibility of interference when wires are close to each other as you apparently know or you wouldn’t be asking. But if all the AC wires are shielded, this should greatly reduce if not totally eliminate the chances of it. This is even more so if your pots wires are shielded also of course. I don’t think you will have problems but the way to know for sure is to try it! Sorry I’m not stating a definitive answer that you are probably looking for.

    However, it’s said a car (with a metal body and when your not touching the metal itself) is one of the safest places to be in a lightning storm because when the lightning strikes the car (metal), the electricity produces a magnetic field (Faraday shield or cage) around it shielding the passengers within from the electricity itself. Shielded wire just has the opposite effect, keeping everything on the inside instead of on the outside.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    Hello @BlazinH,
    THANKS so much for your info.
    Let me clarify - I will be using the standard (gray or black) plastic encased 14/3 wGround - Of course, inside, each wire is encased. "Me" thinks shielding means this - (not a grounding shield wrapped around
    the wires, such as our tv cable wire). The phone cable that I will be using is the same way....NO extra "shielding"....just good quality phone cable.
    I would like to encase both inside of gray flexible conduit......so it will be neat and "pretty".....go figure...............and as I've always stated, when it comes to electronics and interference problems, well, that's
    all I know, period....
    I just don't want to do this THEN have to tear it all lose and start over....you know, measure 8 times, cut once or twice theory.

    The reason for this question (obvious) was the fact I'll be using opto-isolators to reduce or eliminate interference inside my electronics box.....

    Stay in touch friend and many blessings.

    Tom
  8. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    I see Tom! Your meaning was insulated wire instead of shielded. Without shielding, you very well may have issues. You can make your own shielding though if needed. I haven’t done it myself, but you can take some aluminum foil for example, and wrap it around the “romex” wire or the telephone wire. Just wrap it like you would if you were taping a bicycle handlebar or you could also use strips of foil and tape them together at the seams. Once you put it into the conduit, you wont see it so it doesn’t have to be pretty, just effective. Or, you might just look into getting shielded wire for your pots and throw out the telephone wire idea.
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    @BlazinH,
    Thanks - that's a sure fix.
    I just need to "wrap the romex", NOT both -
    IF I can find shielded small wire for the pots, would it still be a good idea to wrap the romex?
    Any idea or web sites where I could obtain the shielded pot cable?
    Thanks so much. You have always come up with good solutions for me.

    Have a blessed day,

    Tom
  10. insanegr

    insanegr !N$@n€

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    a utp cat6 cable has a shield on each pairs and and a shield for all of them, you can give it a try.
    cheap and can be found easy.
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
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  11. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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  12. telfel

    telfel Active Member

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    Hi
    In electrical terms it is not good practice to run HV and lv cables in the same conduit, better to run 1 for HV and 1 for LV, just zip the the two together
    Regards Terry
    • Agree Agree x 2
  13. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Tom , I’m glad to see you have gotten some suggestions from other members too! Both of them are good ones. But while it may not be good practice to run high and low voltages close together, it can be done with the proper shielding. The cat6 cable sounds like it may work if you are using standard pots as you are as I now recall. I started thinking in terms of hall effects that require three wires. If that were the case, and if you don’t mind paying a premium for them, you could buy three shielded stereo cables from Radio Shack and just cut the stereo plug off both ends. While RS is high priced, I’m pretty sure you would have one down the street from you somewhere (if you were in a hurry that is). There are 20 of them in the Oklahoma City metroplex and I found at least 3 of them where you live. The OKC metroplex does include around 55 cities however even though they mostly all run together. I have one less than a mile away from me though that is good for emergencies. Of course, if you’re not in a hurry, fleebay works too!

    Btw, as long as the shielding doesn’t leak and you don't get interference coming in from connection points etc., just shielding the pot wires should be sufficient I think. Its better to shield the pots instead of just the romex in case there is interference coming from other areas. But small holes in the shielding may still be okay! That's why braided wire still works for shielding purposes. The higher the voltage, the larger the holes can be. Here’s an example to show you. This videos description states, “This Australian maniac has a giant Tesla coil in his backyard”.

    It figures it’s from another Australian maniac! :grin LOL! Just kidding you Aussie guys!
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2014
  14. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    Hi fellows:
    THANK YOU for your input which has helped measurably.

    See if "ME PLAN" is acceptable.
    1. Romex Cable 14-3 w/g - wrap with aluminum foil - encase in flexible conduit.........just the extra measure
    2. Use shielded cat6 or stereo wire - for pots - I WILL keep this outside the flex conduit, but zip tied to the conduit.

    NOTE: The pots are the DigiKey - Contactless, 5v, 3 connector, 180Degree - IF the above needs modifying due to my "pot type", let me know.

    Blessings and thanks again,

    Tom
  15. insanegr

    insanegr !N$@n€

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    i forgot to mention that a shield must be connected to ground otherwise it wont act as a shield.if i'm wrong someone correct me.
    the best solution for me is what @telfel wrote keep high V away from low V
    • Informative Informative x 1
  16. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    insanegr,
    Yes, I'm going to do what @telfel suggested. One in the flex conduit (14-3 w/g) and the pot cable outside of flex conduit....
    I still want to shield the romex and I will connect the alum foil to the ground - the pot cable will be shielded also and I will ground....
    Just to to make sure I'm doing ALL I can to eliminate any interference.

    Thanks much,

    Tom
  17. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Once one thing is shielded from the other thing in question, doubling up really shouldn't be necessary. If the pots wires are shielded already, shielding the romex only shields everything else. But if you don't mind doing it, might as well! Anyway, I'm sure there is a better solution for getting the shielded wire for your pots than cutting off stereo plugs. But when I had some extras laying around doing nothing else, I cannibalized them! :grin They came from radio Shack too! :grin:grin
  18. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    BlazinH,
    Thanks my friend. I did some searching also. You're right, as usual. I'll keep the romex inside the flex conduit w/o shielding - keep the shielded pot cable "outside" the flex conduit and zip tie. Should be neat
    and tidy.

    Tom
  19. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    It never hurts to ground it! But a car isn't grounded because of its tires but still acts as a shield when struck with electricity! Its not grounding that does the shielding, it's that when electricity comes in contact with metal, an instantaneous magnetic field is created. That field holds the electricity back if you wrap it around something. The higher the voltage, the stronger the field. That's why the metal cage in the video above still shields with big holes in it.

    And while I mean no offense, your solution is not to have one.
  20. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    BlazinH,
    The video is good. Saw this on MythBusters several years ago.......a good refresher for sure.

    BlazinH wrote: And while I mean no offense, your solution is not to have one -
    Please expound on this statement - need to get my head around it.

    Thanks,

    Tom