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New 2dof simulator simtools + Jrk 12v12

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Building Q&A / FAQ' started by gigi, May 29, 2014.

  1. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    C in my project (with motors in front) should be 45cm. I know that closer is C and more is torque necessary. I will use the same motors you use but with 50:1 ratio
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  2. bsft

    bsft

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    that should be ok.
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  3. bsft

    bsft

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    im going to sleep so I will answer more tomorrow.
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  4. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    so how high to you make the connection to the frame?
    Is that what you are asking? Yes. How hight. I must connect the lever of motors This point it's necessary to be highter than the centre of the uni shaft .I saw that in projects with motors behind the point of attachment of the engine is at shoulder height. I do not understand the physics, but I think there is a reason. now mounting the front motorri I can not get the attachment point at the same height but I assume that this height is compared to the centre of the uni shaft
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  5. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    Oh I'm sorry. I don't know what time is in your country.
    the point of attachment of the engine to the frame must be higher than a the centre of the uni shaft. If for how much? B indicates precisely this measure that I don't know
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  6. bsft

    bsft

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    Good morning........
    there is no specific height above the centre of the pivot that the motors need to be connected.
    I dont have a photo, but at one stage I mounted my motors at the steering wheel height. Motors were 400mm from pivot I think and connected on the sides of the wheel mount. So about middle of my chest. The difference was noticable for sure between that and mounting them at my knees or lower. But I had to make the motors more out to the side. Not really a good idea for me.
    Mounting at shoulders is just about the highest point feasible .
    I dont have a diagram, but your body on the seat on the frame, about your belly button, is a rough guide to the centre of gravity. Because we weigh, the higher we can get above that line, the better the motors perform.
    On the same note as I found out, the further away we can mount the motors as well, works in a similar way, just like leverage. Thats why the foot motor sim was so successful with lower motor connection mounts, I was levering at my feet, not my knees.
    Guys mount their motors right onto the bottom of the seat/main frame, and they still work, but they tend to struggle more.
    My DC motor desk racer loses about 5-10% of tactile motion compared to my shoulder mount DC seat mover. Difference in placement of motors. No problem for me, I can increase the forces a bit more to help make up for it.
    The Diagram will work, anything will work, just how well you would like it to work.
    50:1 boxes will give you the power needed no problem , with a 50mm ctc lever, it should move in a linear motion of about 200mm per second. The minimum we try to get is 150mm per second. That is still sufficient enough motion to snap back and forth and give you decent wobbles. Add bass shakers like @Nick Moxley has done and you will be rattling teeth no problems.
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  7. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    what do you mean with bass shaker? buttckiker gamer?
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  8. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    So let's see if I understand correctly
    Look at the drawings project A and project B. You Say That there is no difference?
    One of the two solutions is not better than the other?
    Why in your desk sim project you connected the motors almost at the same height of the knees and no more 'down?Why many sim project with engine behind the seat motors are connected to almost shoulder height?

    Attached Files:

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  9. bsft

    bsft

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    With frame design, I been through about 14 different designs and mods to frames, anything will work. It is just how well it works and how well you want to move and also, how much space you have.
    When I started , I didnt have much room, I had to navigate several doorways, a hall way and then had to make the sim no more that 1.2m long because of the short space behind my desk. So I had to come up with different designs to get it right.

    Back you your designs, sim 001 with produce better motion results that diagram 002, because the motors connect higher and you are getting up near the centre of gravity. Thats good for a full frame.

    As said, because we are dealing with gravity, the higher you can get the motors to connect, the better they work.
    The shoulder mount at the rear is the best by far to get heaps of weight moving and also produce better motion. Unless you want to use powerful actuators to overcome a low motor mount design.

    Its simple, wheres the better point to move your weight from, underneath where gravity pushes you down? Or higher up where you are above that centre of gravity weight.

    The desk racer is a seat mover and I had to content with a design I could easily get in and out of. I could have made the motor connections higher, but I put them where I could for the design. They can go higher but making getting in and out is a bit trickier as its at a desk and not on seat rails to overcome the problem of me getting in and out.
    I made the motor mounts as high as I could to get near that centre of gravity.

    Without making them lower, I did a test, I sat my 8 yr son, whom is 25 kg extra on my lap, making the ride heavier and also the weight (centre of gravity) higher. The sim still moved and I lost about 5-10% of motion feeling. No problem, wind up the profiles a bit to compensate, but the motors are under a greater load . Shoulder mount is not under such a great load.

    Hope that explains things a bit more.
    Cheers, David.
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  10. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    Thanks you explain very well. But if i haven't problems of space do you think is better for me put the motors read the seats? Also with a sim with pedals and steering connnected and not desk sim?
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  11. bsft

    bsft

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    If you have the room, minimum 800mm wide , and you can use the length of up to 1.8m long depending on overall length, then yes, shoulder mount at rear is by far the best option for full frame.
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  12. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    I thank you once again david.
    You are always very clear and helpful.
    I do not have big space available but I would like to create the best solution, therefore, once again I see my plans and re-evaluate the possibility of putting the motors behind the seat.
    In the meantime .... Motors incoming, jrk 12v12 arrived, power supplies coming.
    thanks!
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  13. bsft

    bsft

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    No worries man , I have spent a lot of time building compact units. They work well, and as said , your diagram sim001 will work well if you need smaller size frame.
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  14. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    hello guys, I apologize if you are no longer 'intervened.
    I have almost completed the mechanical part, last week I got the two motors, potentiometers, two power supplies ..... all set to begin the second phase of assembly ........ but falling from a stool in my office I broke the heel of the right foot and now I'm in the hospital waiting for surgery ...
    I will return 'soon
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  15. bsft

    bsft

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    ouch
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  16. AceOfSpies

    AceOfSpies Living the Dream!

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    Bad luck @gigi. Get well soon:thumbs

    Mike
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  17. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    Thank you mike

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  18. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    hello guys!
    because due to my injury I can not complete the mechanical part of my simulator I want to turn to the electronics. I state that I have no knowledge of electronics .... electronically speaking then consider me a fool.
    First question. I purchased potentiometers suggested by BSFT. are the bourns 6639s multitourns. The wiring diagram I found here and that shows the connection of the potentiometer to the board jrk 12v12 indicates three poles: GND - FEEDBACK - 3. 5V IN NEAR July But I just read in my pot: 1, 2, 3. Which of these is the GND, which is what the FEEDBACK and 3. 5V IN NEAR July?
    Thanks for your help

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  19. bsft

    bsft

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    there should be a diagram on the back or side of the pot
    something like this
    pot wiring.jpg
    sorry, its dark and I dont have time to look at the sim in the garage.
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  20. gigi

    gigi Active Member

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    I can not read it is written too small, I read only 1, 2, 3, and close to 3 CW. but if I confirm that I diagram you posted .... perfect for me
    GND and 3. 5V IN NEAR need to connect each two pins on the board while only the FEEDBACK pin "FB"? correct?
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