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Need help getting started with FS2020 SDK

Discussion in 'Other Flight Simulation Games' started by Dirty, Sep 2, 2020.

  1. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Hey Guys, :sos

    @pmvcda, @knaufinator, @Dschadu, @value1, @yobuddy, @Wagnard or @AnyoneElseWhoMightBeAbleToHelpMeOutOfThisMisery :)

    I @mentioned you here, because I am struggling to get started with the FS2020 SDK and I am hoping someone could point me off in the right direction.

    I have FS2020 and activated dev mode, I have downloaded the SDK and installed it. Now I am stuck! :) No Kidding!
    Where did it install the files? Are there any example projects? What do I need to do to read a simple variable from SimConnect? Can I write a simple little C# (WPF or WinForms) app for that or will I have to use c++?

    Can one of you make me a simple little console application to read some variables from SimConnect and send me the VS solution? I'm sure as soon as I have some example code running, I can dig my way through, but so far I have no clue where even to start digging.

    I know that this is gonna cost you an hour or two. I can assure you that in some form or another I will repay this hour to the community (with interests!) as soon as I stumble across some other member struggling with something that I can provide help with.

    Could anyone help me getting started?
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    Last edited: Sep 2, 2020
  2. Ads Master

    Ads Master

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  3. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    My Motion Simulator:
    6DOF
    You have an example included in the sdk , it's called RequestData

    upload_2020-9-2_12-26-39.png

    Location depends on your instalation.
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  4. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    You are going to find some really strange behaviours by FS 2020....

    @hexpod showed me the plane grounded with parking brakes and with throttle.
    We get a longitudinal acceleration, although oscilating, it's always positive, and with the plane horizontal and stopped.

    I will dare to say those are Matrix physics... But I might be missing something
  5. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Hey :)

    thank you very much. I reinstalled the SDK (again) and now finally found the folder in C:/MSFS_SDK

    I wasn't able to compile the "RequestData" project. It complained about something with the build target...
    Anmerkung 2020-09-02 204801.png
    Does that ring a bell with you?, because I am clueless.

    However, I was able to compile C:/MSFS_SDK/Samples/SimvarWatcher. A WPF app that allows you to watch and set certain variables inside the sim :) I think I can learn a lot from this. At least now I have the feeling I am digging in the right direction :)

    Thx, Dirty :)
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  6. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Yeah, we chattet just this afternoon and it was one of the reasons why I wanted to take a look at the SDK and be able to read those variables myself.

    I thought I would find some error or misconception, but after looking at the raw data from all angles I can confirm: It is totally screwed up. Even more so than with FSX/P3D :confused:

    I am normally not shy to postulate the strangest concepts and hypothetical frameworks in which something COULD still make some sort of sense. But in this case after about two hours I simply gave up in resignation.

    I reproduced the situation where the aircraft had the parking brake set and the ACCELERATION_BODY_Z showed a value that was exactly the acceleration that the aircraft COULD'VE HAD if it WEREN'T constrained by the parking brake. WTF!?!

    Then when I cut the power on the engine, the values settled down to smaller numbers, but long before they ever reached zero, the values all of a sudden jumped to zero and stayed there. As if smaller values were just "cut off".

    Then during turns the gravitational acceleration showed up only in the lateral and longitudinal accelerations! Even though there wasn't any proper acceleration present.

    OK. Long story short: I don't think this thing will ever be used for flight training unless they change something substantial about the flight model.
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    Last edited: Sep 6, 2020
  7. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Go to project properties and make sure you have this:
    upload_2020-9-2_20-39-7.png

    upload_2020-9-2_20-40-16.png

    upload_2020-9-2_20-39-32.png

    And don't forget to copy the SimConnect.dll to the exe folder of the debug and release
  8. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Thank you. I will try this first thing tomorrow. :thumbs

    How do you know all this??? I sometimes feel as if back then in middle school, when I was sick at home for two weeks, everyone was called in for a secret meeting where they agreed to meet once a week in a secret place to learn programming together, but were all sworn in to "...never tell Frank".:)

    How can 15 year old kids hack into a NASA satellite, while I am struggling to even get the IDE set up correctly? :confused:

    Thank you (once more) :thumbs
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    Last edited: Sep 3, 2020
  9. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    So tonight, I decided to verify everything again.
    We never know... I find so strange that longitudinal acceleration.
    But it's there. I cleaned everything and data is direct form game, no Mover here.
    Took some shots this morning.

    Full throttle with brakes:
    upload_2020-9-3_10-9-12.png

    Picking up speed (no brakes):
    upload_2020-9-3_10-7-23.png

    Amazing how instead of progressing we are stuck 30 years back or even go back (PCARS3 :()

    (don't look at the frame rate 39fps, I have everything maxed just for testing)
  10. hexpod

    hexpod http://heXpod.xyz

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Those seems to be our contact guys :

    00AEF693-1EDC-4B68-88B6-31EC58B2EA2E.jpeg

    – Martial Bossard, Lead Software Engineer, Co-Founder, Asobo Studio
    Martial graduated from a French mathematics (...) developing the main features and technology around gameplay, AI and physics for Asobo Studio.

    He is the lead content programmer and project technical director for “Microsoft Flight Simulator.” As such, he has his hands in most all areas of the game that relate to user experience and game services. He supports, manages and prioritizes the team objectives as they relate to the product interface, systems, tools, flight models and the online and live services. He is also actively involved in the development of the SDK. In 2002, he co-founded Asobo Studio, well known for having shipped 23 games.

    Martial is enthusiastically seeking his pilot’s license and has been flying planes since early 2018.


    01374DFC-6F8D-4439-8644-68987E41907D.jpeg
    – Sebastian Wloch, CEO, Co-Founder, Asobo Studio
    Sebastian started creating games as an independent developer in the early 90’s. (...)

    Currently completing his pilot license, Sebastian is involved in the development of “Microsoft Flight Simulator” and manages the programming team focusing on the flight model and SDworld rendering.
  11. hexpod

    hexpod http://heXpod.xyz

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    Maybe we should write the guys directly, speaking in the name of developers and big motion users community.

    I continue to hope they can output for us something we could use.

    What do you think ?
  12. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    I (personally) would wait just a little longer, because I have literally just yesterday started looking into the data export, and I wouldn't want to give the guy the impression as if I have no clue of the game. I am just not an experienced MSFS user.

    But you guys have done a lot already, so I think it would be OK to shoot him an email. I would certainly support that.
  13. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Since this studio doesnt claim to be flight simulator specialist SimConnect might be fubar now :D.
  14. yobuddy

    yobuddy Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator SimAxe Beta Tester SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    Really interesting ready guys. :thumbs
    I really hope they upgrade the telemetry system along with the game.
    Seems a shame for a such a modern game to have and old output system
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  15. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Hey There :)

    I had the pleasure of a long chat with the lead developer of DRAG. Here's a promo video of the driving dynamics.


    This dude is just crazy about vehicle motion dynamics simulation. He agreed that the data we're seeing as ACCELERATION_BODY_XYZ are not what one would expect. But given the FS2020 developers have a solid math/physics background, he suspects the underlying simulation to still be correct and the problem to be in the export interface.

    In condensed form:
    You ask the export interface for a variable that might not be used in the simulation directly, but has to be derived from other data and then formatted for export. Now, if the simulation has been modified, it might be that the export interface hasn't been modified to reflect that change.

    He said we have three possible options:
    - Wait patiently for a fix
    - Win-over the developers "heart" and get him to support our cause (without annoying him)
    - Pay for the services we need

    I think we have reported the strange values properly via ZenDesk. What I would still do would be to shoot them an email. It would be a bit of a bold move and I don't think they will even read the mails coming into these accounts, but we have nothing to lose here :)
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    Last edited: Sep 6, 2020
  16. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    I think I got it :)

    At least I got a trace!

    @hexpod sent me a link to an interview with the developers this morning and I was wondering why in the world they used the term "loadfactor". That's not a term I would ever use.... So I looked for a variable called Loadfactor in the SDK...


    And found it:
    SJHDGFLKJSFHLGJKSHDGLKJSDHLFGK.png

    At least vertical G,... oh sorry... I meant "SEMIBODY LOADFACTOR Y" is available. :thumbs The documentation stated that X and Z are not supported.

    Then I looked into the Sim variables directly and indeed, I found "SEMIBODY LOADFACTOR X" and "SEMIBODY LOADFACTOR Z" also.
    XCVBXVBXCBXCV.png
    even though X and Z stay at zero, but at least they ARE THERE! I hope that they will at some point fill those slots with life.

    @pmvcda , can you check if those variables are also available in FSX/P3D? If they are NOT, it means that they have added them specifically for FS2020. That would be a good sign for the future.

    And if they ARE there already, then at least you can now use them for FSX/P3D

    What do you think?
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  17. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    I will look at both later.
  18. hexpod

    hexpod http://heXpod.xyz

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    It could be useful to paste it here :
    https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/flight-model-acceleration-body-xyz-severe-issue/252132
  19. hexpod

    hexpod http://heXpod.xyz

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    With what value it is starting? 1? Is there the gravity component present?
  20. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Yes, on SEMIBODY LOADFACTOR Y the gravity component is present. I don't quite remember which value it starts with, but while static on ground it has a value close to 1.

    As far as I tested it, it represents the vertical acceleration in the vehicle coordinate system during all phases.

    Try it out and tell me what you think.
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