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Linear actuator using ClearPath Integrated Servo System @ 72V DC

Discussion in 'Motor actuators and drivers' started by Dirty, Apr 7, 2018.

  1. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    I think 30° is a lot. In professional Level D Full Flight Sims normally 15° is all you need. @apointner and I have booked one of those for two hours and measured the angles. I think 15° was the max in acceleration. And I think I remember it was 18° during braking.
  2. dureiken

    dureiken Active Member

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    and you aim for what ? :)
  3. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    I aim for a setup that is tuned in such a way that it might hit an end stop only about once every operating hour :grin I know that is not a satisfactory answer ;) Sorry.

    To be honest, I didn't even know the pitch or roll limit of my planned rig. I had to check and I found it can reach a pitch of 28° before an actuator reaches it's max travel.
    Bildschirmfoto 2019-12-21 um 20.18.37.png

    Be aware that there are other limits you can run into, like the max angles of the U-joints or the max motor speed or the max motor torque.

    If ever someone asks about the max angles (Pitch, Roll Yaw) of a rig, the only sensible answer would be to ask back: At which translational position (X/Y/Z)?

    This body represents all possible XYZ coordinates the center of the upper platform can go to:
    Workspace vertical.png Workspace lateral.png
    - You can reach the true max Pitch only when the platform is in exactly one point somewhere close (but not exactly in) the middle of that body.
    - You can reach the true max Roll only when the platform is in exactly one point somewhere close (but not exactly in) the middle of that body.
    - You can reach the true max Yaw only when the platform is in exactly one point somewhere close (but not exactly in) the middle of that body.

    ...funny thing is: Those points are not identical :confused:

    I find it non sensical to specify max values for Pitch/Roll/Yaw/Surge/Sway/Heave and in my software I don't have them. All I have is a little knowledge on how filters work, and an hour of time to do some tuning. All I can say is that it is highly improbable that the rig will reach an end stop, not impossible.

    I'm not sure how to call this. Maybe "the heuristic approach" would best describe it :). At some point I plan on implementing an autotune algorithm, but that is still a few years into the future. So, for now, manual tuning of the filters is what it comes down to.

    Dirty :)
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  4. Builder

    Builder New Member

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    Hello Dirty,

    After reading the design form @FlyPT and the comments form @Thanos i decided to build a rig with servo motors. I was delighted to read your article in which your design was close to my own ideas.
    Do you already have your rig working?
    I am also very curious if you have an update of your Actuator design.
    Do you also have the 3d print files to share.
    And finally, do you also have a file of the lasercut aluminum parts.

    I am very curious about your reaction.
  5. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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  6. Sebj

    Sebj Active Member

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    Looks pro
    Congratulations
  7. Builder

    Builder New Member

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    Hey Dirty,

    thanks for your quick reply. That looks absolutly fantastic. I also want to use the rig for flight simulation.
    I will read your new threat this weekend and surely will come back with some questions. :thumbs
  8. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Any time!!!

    I have another thread where I talk about the software I wrote:
    https://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/writing-a-motion-cueing-software-from-scratch.13108/

    But regardless of which software you want to use (Mover, SimTools, BFF, X-Sim, Nutkicker or even your own custom), there are alway two "cornerstone" questions that will guide you the way:
    1. What are the accelerations on board the vehicle?
    2. What does a LP or HP filter do to the signal?

    If you can get a clear picture in respect to those questions, motion cueing will become one coherent logical construct (for lack of a better term). You can solve many problems by finding answers to those questions.

    Cheers,... Dirty :)
  9. Builder

    Builder New Member

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    I couldn't help myself but read your other threat right away. I also went through the current threat again. However, I cannot find your 3D print files. Do you already have these available?
    I am also curious about your drawings for the lasercut aluminum.

    thanks in advance
    Builder
  10. Dirty

    Dirty Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    I thought I had a link somewhere to the Fusion360 CAD files. Try this, let me know if it works. There might be some broken joints in the assembly though.
  11. Builder

    Builder New Member

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    Bingo! This link works, Thanks. :thumbs
    It realy looks very professional. Now have to figure out how to extract the different files. But that will be tommorow. First today make a familie visit to your country.

    Thanks a lot.
  12. Builder

    Builder New Member

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    After a lot of reading and comparing, I think about purchasing the following servos:
    80ST-M02430.These have a speed; of 3000 rpm and a torque of 2.4 Nm. Would you also recommend the SFU1610 or the SFU1605 for these servos.
  13. Thanos

    Thanos Building the Future one AC Servo at a time... or 6

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    SFU1610 will give 500mm/s speed, but load ability up to 80kg.

    SFU1605 will give 250mm/s speed and load ability up to 160kg.
  14. Builder

    Builder New Member

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    Is Speed Now Important or Torque?
    It seems to me that with an 80Kg load you can move a small cockpit with a 6DOF (3 monitors, flight stick, small instrument panel etc)
    Is the speed important or does this not matter much in this comparison, and should I look more at the resolution. (accuracy over a short distance)
  15. adgun

    adgun Active Member

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    Hi Thanos how do you get to dose low forces
    2.4nm at 3000rpm is 750watt
    1 watt is 1 newton with a speed of 1 meter a second, so a 750w motor delivers 1500newton at 500mm second minus efficienty ballscrew 90% gives 1350newton and 500mm sec. at rated power , and 2700newton at 250mm sec.
    regards Ad
  16. Thanos

    Thanos Building the Future one AC Servo at a time... or 6

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    The numbers I gave are based on measurements on actual actuators... in theory they can deliver more. But you have to take in consideration other parameters of the actuators, links and bits.

    Also the numbers I posted are for duty cycle 100% use of the actuator. Going above these load numbers, you will reduce the leadscrew lifetime expectancy, or introduce significant wear and tear.

    Only if you are using heavy duty and well built actuators you could load them further. See for example the specs of these Scorpion actuators:

    Servo Scorpion actuators
    (speed:250mm/s,force:200kg,stroke:150mm/5.91 inches)
    Ball screws: TBI ( Made in Taiwan, China )
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
  17. T R Para

    T R Para i make stuff up Gold Contributor

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    Finally got fusion 360 to load on my pc..
    I am interested in printing out some of the plastic parts.
    I think I have exported the Slider....
    maybe someone could take a look.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
  18. wannabeaflyer2

    wannabeaflyer2 Well-Known Member

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    Hi @T R Para quick update , from what i hear fusion 360 for home use will lose a lot of functions that we take for granted now , apparently the ability to export STL files will be removed for home users so a lot of the stuff we create for 3D printing will need to be done on another package,, it was a case of it was good while it lassted unless you have $1000 a year for subs :-( Nice work though ....... now save that file on non cloud based backup :)
    • Agree Agree x 2
  19. Thanos

    Thanos Building the Future one AC Servo at a time... or 6

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    And possibly export everything now...
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  20. T R Para

    T R Para i make stuff up Gold Contributor

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    • Informative Informative x 1