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KickStarter T1000 2, 3, 4, 5 Motion!

Discussion in 'Commercial Simulators and Peripherie' started by prosimu, Jun 7, 2015.

  1. prosimu

    prosimu Member Gold Contributor

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    Hi All,

    We just launch our Kickstarter campaign for the T1000 2, 3, 4, 5 motion ! Share it, support us!

    Nous venons de lancer notre campagne KickStarter pour le T1000 2, 3, 4, 5 motion ! Partagez, supportez-nous!

    Voici le lien :

    https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1068240120/motion-simulator-t1000-2-3-4-5-actuators-from-1890

    Thanks

    Patrick K
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    Ads Master

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  3. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    @yobuddy and the community are aware of my views concerning a need to review the SimTools license/controls with respect to commercial interests and I think things like this Kickstarter campaign, which lists all SimToos plugin capabilities without a mention of SimTools itself or complying with plugin licensing acknowledgement requirements, is a further indication as to why SimTool license/controls need upgrading:

    http://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/prosimu-t1000-2motion.6649/#post-73390

    http://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/prosimu-t1000-2motion.6649/page-2#post-73466

    http://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/prosimu-t1000-2motion.6649/page-2#post-74426
    • Agree Agree x 5
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2015
  4. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Nothing to be said more than the above links ...
    That's what you'll ever get Patrick ... Zero backers ... Zero comments ... Zero popularity ...
    Going down fast :p .
    You didn't even become a gold supporter :( .
    I respect your courage ... But you should respect the community please ...


    Rien à dire de plus que les liens ci-dessus ...
    Voilà ce que vous obtiendrez jamais Patrick ... Zéro bailleurs de ... zéro commentaires ... Zéro popularité ...
    Descente rapide :p .
    Vous avez même pas devenir un partisan de l'or :( .
    Je respecte votre courage ... Mais vous devez respecter la communauté s'il vous plaît ...
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2015
  5. yobuddy

    yobuddy Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator SimAxe Beta Tester SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    I really can’t believe the nerve of these guys!
    Tell them no, and they just do it anyway.
    These kinds of people are destroying the whole sim scene for me.

    I will not work on SimTools only to have companies take advantage of the community and my software!
    This is the main reason why no new versions have been released.
    (Although 1.4 is used by quite a few people already – and 2.0 is even being tested by a few people)

    Please do not support companies that are only after your money, and could care less about who they step on to get your money.

    yobuddy
    • Agree Agree x 12
    • Like Like x 1
  6. value1

    value1 Nerd Staff Member Moderator SimAxe Beta Tester SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    Fully agree! Difficult to express my disappointment of @prosimu without being as impolite as he is…
    • Agree Agree x 3
  7. prosimu

    prosimu Member Gold Contributor

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    @speedy @value1 Sorry I forgot to take the supporter package.... now it's done.


    @yobuddy I send several email to you in order to have some explanations/collaborations with you... but i never receive any response from you. Felicitation, you do a great job for the community!

    Our goal is to build simulators for people who doesn't have time to build or knowledge/materials for building a simulator, we manufactures simulator with low price as we could,.... If people buy our simulators, the community will grow-up and obviously they will support SimTool and your work!!! We are not a big company like Logitech or Fanatec..... if we were like this, we never do KickStarter campaign.....and do our own software!

    Our goal is to make the simulation accessible to everyone and i think that we have the same goal!!!


    Thanks

    Patrick
  8. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    I believe the questions and concerns that the SimTools community have need to be appropriately raised where they are most applicable, the Kickstarter campaign.

    I have raised my concerns with Patrick as they pertain to the Kickstarter campaign, via Kickstarter itself. Should there need to be a further discussion I am more than willing to invest 1 Euro as a backer and hold that conversation in the Comments section of the Kickstarter campaign, where it appropriately belongs.

    Patrick.jpg
    • Winner Winner x 1
  9. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Its clear that you are not attempting to help facilitate DIY builders but instead supply them with a commercial alternative for a profit. This constitutes commercial use and invalidates your rights imo to tell people that they can use simtools with your product after purchase when you are not already supplying them with your own native solution.

    This is your excuse for disregarding Simtools license and the author’s copyright? Pathetic! It is not your place to make this decision!!!

    Commercial use constitutes profiting either directly or indirectly. Even though you are not using the word simtools in your literature, you are obviously directing your purchasing customers to various places where they can obtain necessary software for your simulator to function, including simtools by your own statements. You would most likely not sell any simulators at all by just supplying a rig and motor control software without letting your customers know a way for it to connect to various games also and where to get it from. Therefore, I contend that you are indeed profiting indirectly from simtools and/or other motion extraction software and are guilty of license infringement! That is at least my personal view. Regardless, the author of simtools has asked you to not do this yet you still persist in making excuses to justify your actions. Again, pathetic! This is usually not the stance taken by a reputable company!
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Winner Winner x 1
  10. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    So what ? IMO apology is not accepted as there are a big list of what you've forgotten ... you are still like any other gold supporter ... that is a fraction of what www.Xsimulator.net disserves .

    So, You are taking advantage of SimTools as ready S/W without paying for it's previous development plus holding it back ...
    Then your next step is to make your own S/W after you gain enough money to kill this community down ...
    Obviously we will hold you back with a big hammer and I'm sorry ... Good job @noorbeast :thumbs every Euro counts :grin .
    I like France and what is made in France ... but you are imparessing yourself and all the French members here too :blush .

    If you really want to be supported by this huge community all over the world :thumbs ... You can't imagine , How much ?
    PLEASE , DO AS WHAT @yobuddy DEMANDS ...
    HE IS MORE THAN FAIR PERSON .

    See you soon with a GREEN FLAG mon amie .
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2015
  11. value1

    value1 Nerd Staff Member Moderator SimAxe Beta Tester SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    "Oh, I just forgot to show you my respect and gratitude" doesn't work! It's that attitude that concerns me. :(
    • Agree Agree x 3
  12. Boomslangnz

    Boomslangnz Active Member SimAxe Beta Tester Gold Contributor

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    What a tool. Unbelievable man to not even get permission but just assume its fine to take others hardwork for your own personal gain. This community has been wonderful and beyond helpful on everything. Making a motion sim was once a simple dream for me but thanks to @yobuddy and @value1 with the software and some of the plugins its become a reality and I can't thank them enough.

    Make your own software and find your own data for games if you do not have permission and the blessing of Simtools. Stating you are a small company etc doesn't mean anything, it's a stupid excuse.

    I would suggest you report him on kickstarter
    Intellectual property violation
    A project is infringing on your copyright or trademark.
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2015
  13. AceOfSpies

    AceOfSpies Living the Dream!

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    I am in complete agreement with all of the comments above. This is nothing short of the worst kind of piracy!
    It is absolutely despicable! I would urge any potential backers to think long and hard about the ethics displayed by this Company before they part with any cash!
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. prosimu

    prosimu Member Gold Contributor

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    Hi Noorbeast,

    Like i say everytime : "Our goal is to make the simulation accessible to everyone and i think that we have the same goal"

    My clients buy our simulators and then could choose the software that they want to use : X-Sim, Lince, SimTool.

    Some other software like "X-Sim" have a special offer for the professional : http://www.x-sim.de/software.php?lang=eng&page=termscommercial

    Why SimTool don't do the same?

    If you want only DIY user for the community, just remove your section : Non DIY Simulators | Commercial ones and remove the other section "Motion Simulator Assembled" http://www.xsimulator.net/community/marketplace/categories/motion-simulator-assembled.20/ and remove all adverts from different company who manufactures Simulators.


    Notice that in the section "Motion Simulator Assembled" you have this sentence..... "Currently we are looking for partners who are interested in offering their simulators here." It's a joke??

    I think SimTools team must reflect what they want?


    Frex mentionned your software in their product and you don't do anything.... http://frex.xsrv.jp/gpshop/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=1_39&products_id=213


    "It's so easy to lead a cabal against a company.... Go Go Go!!! Fire!"



    I would be happy to be a partner and mentionned (on kickstarter/website/facebook....) that our simulator are compatible with SimTool and write each developper who works on the different plugins.....



    Thanks

    Patrick
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    Patrick what you want to do is make money from selling motion simulator hardware. What SimTools does is make motion simulation software available for free for non commercial purposes, these are not the same things!

    You can negotiate a commercial license and you have been encouraged to do so numerous times. There is nothing obtuse about this, nor is there a necessity to mirror arrangement that pertain to other software.

    Yes Frex mentions compatibility with other software but also has its own motion software, that is a very different situation.

    This is not a cabal against a company, it is a community clearly stating what it expects of your company...to comply with respect to license requirements already in place, that if you want to financially capitalize on SimTools then negotiate a commercial license arrangement rather than exploit its existence, the talented developers who created SimTools and its plugins, as well as the dedicated and exceedingly active community that give freely of their time and expertise.
    • Like Like x 1
  16. prosimu

    prosimu Member Gold Contributor

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    Hi Noorbeast,

    Thanks a lot for your constructive reply! And thanks for the link! I'm agree with you for your proposition of a commercial licence, i've just ask for this. I have ask for this in the past, but haven't receive any response....

    I know that there is a lot of talented developers on SimTool/plugins and the website is updated frequently. :thumbs


    Thanks

    Patrick
    • Dumb Dumb x 1
  17. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    First of all @prosimu ... I think you should stop the hide and seek game because it is for kids only :oops: ...
    Unless you want to lose access or your site being blocked :eek: ...

    And Obviously YOU'RE leading a cabal against SimTools community which is not a good way to start a business :oops:...

    You don't want to at least put direct links to xsimulator.net at your site plus what is required from you in Euros :(...

    So you leave it blind to those whom you can deceive :think and make sure you profit more from the remote installation ...

    which we do everything for free and that is the fun part for us [ we are Excellent into this department and don't challenge us ] . :popcorn

    Tout d'abord @prosimu ... Je pense que vous devriez arrêter le jeu de cache-cache, car il est à seulement les enfants :oops: ...
    Sauf si vous voulez perdre l'accès ou votre site bloqué :eek: ...

    Et évidemment, vous menez une cabale contre SimTools communauté qui est pas une bonne façon de démarrer une entreprise :oops: ...

    Vous ne voulez pas de liens directs au moins mis à xsimulator.net sur votre site ainsi que ce qui est exigé de vous en Euros :( ...

    Donc, vous le laissez aveugle à ceux que vous pouvez tromper :think et assurez-vous de profiter davantage de l'installation à distance ...

    que nous faisons tout gratuitement et qui est la partie de plaisir pour nous [nous sommes en excellente ce département et nous ne remettons pas en]. :popcorn
    • Like Like x 1
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2015
  18. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    They do! :) But the developers of simtools have so far chosen not to offer commercial licenses for purchase on their web site, but instead directly to commercial entities to sell with their products.

    With xsim, I can see how it is not unethical for you to mention them and to point your customers to their website because they actually have a way for your customers to themselves purchase the proper commercial license (that is if they are honest and choose to do the right thing). But since simtools does not offer commercial licenses for purchase to individuals, it is unethical for you to refer you customers to it since there is no way for them to actually purchase the proper license themselves! I think the same holds true for Frex as well.

    If your customers just happen to run across xsimulator.net on their own, with no direction from you, and choose to use simtools, that is a completely different matter than when you are directing them to it!
    • Like Like x 1
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015