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Tutorial "HPMC" High Power Motor controller H-bridge using N-MOSFETs

Discussion in 'Motor actuators and drivers' started by speedy, Dec 21, 2013.

  1. Cvetan Cvetanov

    Cvetan Cvetanov Member

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    Thank you i will try this. I want to ask you about another h bridge with ir2184 with same motor - with same motor scope look like this pic
    20151207_133734.jpg

    With some 4700uf/50v and 100nf/50v capacitors on psu close to transistor look like this
    20151207_132155.jpg
    And between power lines
    20151207_132042.jpg
  2. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    Electromagnetic Interference Reduction
    C/P from here ...
    http://www.stefanv.com/rcstuff/qf200005.html
    Filtering
    Even a motor in perfect condition will produce some electrical noise, so some form of filtering is needed to keep that noise from getting to the receiver. The simplest filters consist of one, two, or three capacitors, as shown in Figures 1 to 3
    figure1.gif
    Figure 1. A single-capacitor filter. The capacitor is simply soldered across the motor terminals.

    A capacitor is an electronic component that will conduct only currents that are changing at a high frequency. A single capacitor wired across the motor terminals will act as a short circuit for high-frequency electrical noise, while not affecting the power to the motor at all. This reduces conduction of noise along the motor wiring.
    figure2.gif
    Figure 2. A two-capacitor filter. Each capacitor has one lead attached to a motor terminal, and the other lead attached to the case.

    When two capacitors are used, each one is connected between the motor casing and one motor terminal. This has the effect of shorting the casing and terminals together from the noise’s point of view. Including the casing in the circuit will reduce radiated noise by making the casing a shield.
    figure3.gif
    Figure 3. A three-capacitor filter. This is basically a combination of the one- and two-capacitor circuits.

    The three-capacitor filter is just a combination of the one- and two-capacitor versions. One capacitor is connected across the motor terminals and one is connected to each terminal and the motor casing. This is the filter that I use on all my aircraft, and I’ve only had noise problems once (which turned out to be due to an out-of-tune receiver). I use a 0.1µF (micro-Farad) capacitor across the terminals, and a 0.047µF capacitor between each terminal and the case. Photo 1 shows the capacitors installed on a motor.
    photo3.jpg
    Photo 1. A typical three-capacitor filter installation on a ferrite motor. These particular capacitors are older style high-voltage ones; newer ones would be smaller. The black cylinder is the ESCs freewheeling diode.

    When using a high-rate ESC (which all modern ESCs are),NEVER use electrolytic capacitors for noise filtering. The high switching frequency from the ESC will cause such capacitors to explode. Always use ceramic disc or similar capacitors.

    Some motors, such as the Graupner Speed 400 series, come with a two-capacitor filter already installed inside the motor. Additional filtering is often not necessary, although it would do no harm.

    Another method of noise filtering is to loop each motor lead several times through a ferrite ring or bead. One or more such loops of wire, either around a ferrite core or just in midair, is called a choke. A choke is the opposite of a capacitor, in that it will conduct only low frequency signals (such as the power to the motor), while blocking higher frequencies.

    It is possible to construct more elaborate filters using multiple capacitors and chokes. Since chokes conduct motor power and block noise, they are wired in-line with the power leads instead of across the terminals. Figure 4 illustrates a capacitor-choke filter, and Photo 2 shows a commercially available unit sold by Graupner.
    figure4.gif
    Figure 4. A capacitor-choke filter. These are usually assembled on a separate circuit board which is then soldered to the motor terminals.


    High-rate ESCs make use of a Schottky diode for more efficient operation. At part throttle, during the time that the ESC’s MOSFETs are switched off, the diode serves to recirculate motor current. Most ESCs have an on board diode, but some might require you to solder the diode across the motor terminals (with the banded end towards the positive terminal). Do not omit the diode in this case, as it will result in reduced efficiency and increased noise. If your ESC has a diode on board, you should still install one on the motor if the ESC is far from the motor, or if you are operating more than one motor from one ESC. Schottky diodes are available at most hobby shops that carry R/C car supplies.
    t-photo2.jpg
    Photo 2. A capacitor-choke filter sold by Graupner, designed to be soldered directly to any 05-sized can motor, such as a Graupner Speed 600. Graupner also sells a Speed 400 sized filter.

    Any filtering should be done close to the motor, preferably right at the motor terminals. If the filtering is done further away from the motor (e.g. at the ESC output), then the noise must travel along the motor power wires before reaching the filter. The wires would then radiate the noise.

    Try this experiments and see ..
    http://www.schoolphysics.co.uk/age16-19/Electricity and magnetism/Electromagnetic induction/text/Back_emf/index.html
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2015
  3. Cvetan Cvetanov

    Cvetan Cvetanov Member

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    I read and understand that Thank you all day i try to make such thing but did you have any idea 1mf or 100nf for l ? mhenry. I have 20uf 2000v non electrolytic try it but i think something start smoke nothing fried and no real result in noise . 150 nf too . 2x 150nf same.
  4. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    1000 coins Q :
    If the speed of a DC motor is doubled and the flux remains constant, the generated e.m.f.
    (a) remains the same
    (b) is doubled
    (c) is halved
    (d) None of the above
  5. Cvetan Cvetanov

    Cvetan Cvetanov Member

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    My lottery number is C
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  6. denyszandonadi

    denyszandonadi New Member

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    Hi Speedy, can you help me?

    I made your HPMC, but its not working when i try to reply your test of the video.

    The leds of Power Good and Motor Power is on. (Green and Blue)

    But when I tried to spin the motor, touching the wire on 5v, nothing happens...

    Did you know whats possibly going wrong?

    Thank you!
  7. denyszandonadi

    denyszandonadi New Member

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    2 more informations:

    1- Im not using the fan pin out. I use another psu for the fan, because my motor is 24v, and I dont have another fan with 24v.

    2- The fuse of 2A blew. I have no ideia why...

    Thank you very much again!
  8. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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  9. denyszandonadi

    denyszandonadi New Member

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  10. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    Very clear and nice boards . :thumbs
    It looks like you have a defected "IR2110" IC ... I don't know why ? ... But check for this blown resistor and the zener diode next to it ... and make sure you connect the mosfets in the same order " I can't confirm that " ...

    bottom-2.jpg

    that resistor should drive this MOSFET .
    hpmc.jpg
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2016
  11. JAD

    JAD Member

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    Hi Speedy,
    Thanks for your sharing of this HPMC.
    Im attempting to build 1 initially, and then will go for 5 more for a planned 6dof with 24V motors and ballscrew.

    I have ordered all the parts but having trouble understanding just one component.
    Unfortunately my electronics knowledge is basic and I cannot determine equivalent or adequate alternative components by reading the ebay listing title.

    Im looking at the v1.0a top layer silkscreen pdf and see a 2A fuse required in the middle (Its not listed in the parts list)
    From one of the previous photos, it appears to be a resettable polyswitch.
    When I look up ebay.com.au listings, I note there are various options in voltage rating for 2A, eg 16V 30V 250V
    Top Layer.png
    Is it one of these polyswitches or am I completely off the track?

    I presume it should be resettable? Given its under the heatsink and needs stripping to inspect/change it?

    Cheers
  12. carsten

    carsten New Member

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    Speedy, All,
    ... its been a while, but now my project is getting a bit of traction again. (was a bit busy recently)

    As I have my demo Speedy-HPMC working very nicely, I have started to redraw them with EAGLE in order to get the PCB's done here locally in Singapore.

    I have the standard version (the one we have all etched ourselves based on Speedy's perfect design) and hope to have it ready over the weekend, latest next week....and I have made an SMD version... as I need them in a smaller form factor. (obviously the electronics board only... not the mosfet board.) Have not tested the "micro" version yet.

    @speedy: as for now I am going for through hole mounting. Is there any obvious reason why I should not do that and stick with surface mount? (except for ease of desolating broken parts)... my problem is I mostly break the parts by bending the legs for surface mount. Especially for the IC sockets. (I have a 50% failure rate with those...)

    @All: I will make the minimum order quantity. (same price 1 or 10...). I will than build one and see if it really works again... hopefully have this done in November, and post some pics. Anyone than interested can let me know and ill order a new bunch of PCB's. (lets get to that point after I have seen that it works...). No I am definitely not in it to make money of Speedy's design, but as I need more of these boards and having a hard time with the etching, this is the easiest route for me to go...

    Ill keep you updated.

    Carsten
  13. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    Good job @carsten ... Finally some good news here ...
    SMD devices are harder for most guys to use, find, and weld ... or mayby because I'm an old guy that can't see them any more :p .

    Just put some pictures of the suggested modefication
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2016
  14. Eagletrike

    Eagletrike New Member SimAxe Beta Tester Gold Contributor

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    Hi @speedy
    I was going through the thread and noticed the "new controller version". I had a look at the pictures and noticed a few differences between versions
    • No pull down resistors on motor directions before the 74HC08
    • Only utilising 2 logic circuits on 74HC08 with no shut down to the IR2110
    I checked the PDF files on the first page but saw that they are the original ones that I have built definitely a noticeable difference between the files and the pictures in post 49800. Other than the above quotes I haven't been able to find any other references to the "New Version". Was the New Version published?

    Regards
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  15. Eagletrike

    Eagletrike New Member SimAxe Beta Tester Gold Contributor

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    Hi @speedy,

    While looking through the picture of the new version I found a pad not connected to a trace.

    trace enquiry.jpg

    Would I be right in assuming that this is the desired connection?

    trace adjust.jpg

    Regards
    David
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2018
  16. speedy

    speedy Well-Known Member

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    Yes ..thanks for pinning that out :thumbs
    I'll update it asap
    :cheers
  17. motiondynamics

    motiondynamics New Member

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    With these IR2110, is it possible to use mosfet with 90V power supply to drive 90v motors?
  18. motiondynamics

    motiondynamics New Member

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    Guys, I've read and reread this post 3 times to try to figure out how to make the PCB but I'm very confused. I thank Speedy for this beautiful project, but there are 3 different types of PCBs with different tracks. There is some difference in jumpers, in tracks, in connections. Could anyone please tidy up and clearly say which PCB is the right one? I have attached the 3 different PCBs that I found in this post, with the differences.

    Attached Files:

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  19. Eagletrike

    Eagletrike New Member SimAxe Beta Tester Gold Contributor

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    Hi @motiondynamics In my opinion the A.jpg is the latest one but I did put up a post of an error I had found which is only a few posts back.
    • Agree Agree x 1