Tutorial Guide to setting up SimTools for use with the Kangaroo motion controller

I apologize that the tutorial is somewhat unclear atm. I need to rewrite it with all the correct information because some of it has been found to be incorrect. The code posted should work as is without modification. But unless you follow the "Centering Fix", your rig will not be centered.
Getting Started


Below is the minimum code required to make SimTools work with the kangaroo. If it doesn't work, then you probably have something else set incorrectly. You must have the correct code in all three fields (startup, interface, shutdown). Don't worry about the "centering fix" until you get it working with SimTools first.

Note: If you didn't change the bit rate of your kangaroo to 115200, then replace 115200 with 9600.

STARTUP:

1,start<13><10>1,units65535=5000<13><10>2,start<13><10>2,units65535=5000<13><10>

INTERFACE:

1,p<Axis1><13><10>2,p<Axis2><13><10>

SHUTDOWN:
1,powerdown<13><10>2,powerdown<13><10>

I will check everythings and retry.

Thank for your help!

Now it's ok, my rig moves. I have to practive more Simtools, to understand better how works effect because with my test yesterday i noticed that is not like X-sim.

Do you think i can add a second Kangaroo? (i have 4 motors for my rig).

Glad to hear of your success! If you have a large pot range, you probably will need to have the axis values set lower than default to get the proper motion.

You should be able to use two or more kangaroos with SimTools at the same time. You connect each one to its own Com port and set up a second interface in SimTools.

Thanks.
The motors range of my rig is 180°. (do you think i need to change the pots value in Simtools?)

That's enough feedback so you don't really need to do anything more with the kangaroo. But since it is one-half of full range, it will react more quickly to simtool outputs. Therefore, you will have to increase the axis values if you find there is too much motion for your liking.

The tutorial at the top of this post has been revised. It now contains the correct information that will allow you to properly interface your kangaroo with SimTools. It has also been modified to use 12bit output since the kangaroo uses a 12bit ADC and anything more is meaningless.

I just made from kangaroo and sabertooth, the only problem now is that I can't add another outlput such as a brussless controlled by the speed in games ..... have you a low-cost solution ?

Hi @McCorwin , No I don't have a low-cost solution or any solution for that because I have not tried implementing brushless motors myself at this time. Maybe another member can answer that. But if you are unaware, SimTools allows use of multiple interfaces so you can either use a second COM port or use NET output on a second interface to connect with more devices.

TESTING UPDATE: Hi everyone! I apologize this post has been a long time coming but I have finally been able to do some real world testing with the kangaroo on a new rig I have built. I have been attempting to use 90 degree hall effect potentiometers with it now where my initial bench testing was done with inexpensive standard pots. Unfortunately, I have run into a couple of issues.

First, I have found that when using two hall effect pots on the kangaroo, the supply voltage to them from it drops to around 4.5 volts which is unacceptable! I assume this is due to the fact that hall effect pots draw some current to operate. However, the kangaroo draws its power from the 5v BEC on the sabertooth motor controller that is capable of supplying one amp. So I was able to move the positive and negative wires for the hall pots from the kangaroo’s terminals directly to the sabertooths BEC terminals, which solved that issue. But there really isn’t enough room between the spade terminals of the kangaroo and the sabertooths connector to allow for other wires to be put in with the kangaroo. So if you want to try this you may need to solder the wires on the backside of the kangaroo’s or sabertooth’s circuit board.

The second issue I had was in tuning the kangaroo with it’s autotune function. I had no problem setting the maximum and minimum pot values with the teach function. However, when auto tuning, after the initial quick oscillations of the motor it made, it would try to make a fast motion that always gave me the error that my taught limit values were being exceeded and the tuning would cease. Apparently I just don’t have enough movement to get a tune completed successfully or the fast motion is throwing my rig past its limits before it can stop. Without the possibility to get a tune, the kangaroo is worthless as it is unusable. My initial bench testing, besides using standard pots, also used most of the range of those pots, which was closer to 270 degrees instead of 90.

So for my setup they have turned out to be a fail before even starting testing with SimTools. It may be possible to get a satisfactory tune if your pots range is greater than 90 degrees though but I have no way of testing that atm. Just be sure the pots are receiving the full 5v with the fix above if using hall effect pots.

At the moment though, the kangaroo doesn’t look very promising to me as it seems to need to many “fixes” in an attempt to get it working like we need it too. And it also utilizes a PID control where the variables are foreign to what is standard so no one here knows how to tweak them (to my knowledge anyway)!

As of now I cannot recommend the kangaroo. But again, if you’re setup uses over 90 degrees of the pots rotation, you may have success. I recommend you have at least 180 degrees rotation though. Just keep in mind that we haven’t gotten any feedback on this site yet from any kangaroo users that say it’s fantastic. But there haven’t been many members that have tried to use it yet either!

If you are using the kangaroo please make a post here and tell us what you are using for feedback (encoder, std. pot, or hall pot), what range you use on them (90 to 360), and how well it is working for you! Thanks!

Greetings!!
I'm using 2 kangaroos and 2 SyRen 50s. My rig is something out of Floreskies Simulator (a platform) and the motion of a Joyrider. At the moment, I'm testing the "Y" axis of the simulator. I got through the tunings of the Kangaroo from the expert advice of Charleen at Dimension Engineering (www.dimensionengineering.com). First, I had to remove anything that could shake itself to death, ie: 30 inch display, joystick and throttle and replaced them with weights for the tuning. I went to the tuning page from Describe software and tuned. After a 15 degrees upward motion and a 15 degrees downward motion it shook, I mean it really SHOOK!! After which I had to inspect my baby for damage brought about by excessive shaking. I'm proud to say there was none. After all the shaking then the testing begins. I can only get the thing to move is when I change the bit range to 14 - 15 from the 12 bit on the interface page in Simtools 1.2, it goes from neutral to full 15 degrees up and then 15 degrees down at full speed with nothing in between. It seems like something is missing. I'm using 10k single turn Pots for my rig and I think with 15 degrees up and 15 degrees down I'm using around 30 degrees of travel. When I change back to 12 bits on the interface page I get nothing, but I think it is communicating ( or not) with the Flight Sim 2004 software, but no motion. just a huge awakening spasm, and then nothing. Also, on the interface page how many milliseconds for start up- interface - shutdown ( I have not a clue ) Any advice?
jsmith2307

Hi @jsmith2307 , Well, the good news is it sounds like you have managed to get a tune at only 30 degrees rotation! Before you worry about trying to use it with SimTools though, I have attached a simple program for you (and any member here) to use to test the kangaroo with first.



All you need to do is input the COM port # in the box that you will be using and change the baud rate if it is different than 115200 (manually type in a different one). Then choose the channel you want to test with the option box and press “Start”. You can then use “Home” the send your motor to its center position. Then use “UP/DOWN” to change the position you want to call and press “Send” and the motor should move to that position. You can also manually type in a position in the position box and press “Send”. If you wish to change the rate used by “UP/DOWN” just enter what you want to use in the box between the buttons. You can start both channels to test them at the same time if you wish and then use the option box to switch between the two when testing. You must first press "Start" one time for each channel to activate both. Pressing stop will stop both channels regardless if both were started or not.

If you don’t already have a program that uses Visual Basic 6 on your computer you will probably need to download and install the runtime files from Microsoft at the link below.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/192461

Let me know how it goes and Good Luck! Btw there isn’t any error handing routines in the code so if you don’t input a working COM port # or some other error occurs the program will crash. But all you need to do it restart it and try again!

ps You won't be able to use the full position range of 4095 (12bit) because you don't use all of your pots range (unless you use the voltage fix I posted elsewhere). Therefore, the maximum range you can use will be a percentage equal to the pots ranges you are using.

Greetings,
Thank you for responding. I downloaded the program and will comply with the directions given. Thank you, again!!



jsmith2307

Greetings,
I guess I had beter check my hook-up to the kangaroo, I behaves like it did previously, a brief spasam and then nothing. I better check the wireing from the delink to the Kangaroo x2. The dip switch on the Kangaroo remains like it was when I tuned it in Descibe.
jsmith2307

@jsmith2307 I got an email notification today saying you were having problems with mscomm.ocx but now it is not here! Are you still having problems or not? Where is the message you posted? If you deleted the post please don't delete messages already posted because now I'm confused as to what the hell is going on! Just let me know you fixed the problem yourself instead of deleting a previous post if that's what happened please. I also need to know if there is something that I need to fix in case someone else wants to use it too. Thank You.

Edit:I sound mad here. Sorry didn’t mean it that way! I have used my programs for personal use up to now. I always have visual studio 6 on my computers so it always works for me. I should have made an installer to be sure you had all the files that are needed but didn’t think necessary here. Did you just have to restart your computer for it to work or did you install something else from the internet? Thanks

Also jsmith2307 , Did you try DEScribe's Live Test after tuning? If so did it control the motor(s) properly? If they worked with live test then they should work with my test program too!

Greetings,
Sorry, I deleted part of the the message. I did not think anyone had read the post!! My mistake!!
I had another program and lifted " mscomm.ocx" from that!! The program works fine!!! But my simulator does not respond. I'll try Describe.
jsmith2307

Greetings,

Movement! I 've got movement! First I had to go back to square one. I checked my wiring, after a satisfactory retuning in DEScribe, It worked!! Now the bad news. In the “Y” axis (only tested in "Y") the upward travel was much less than I had hoped for and the downward travel was more that expected. My settings on your program was SER, 12 Bits, baud rate @ 115200, mid point 2048, upward movement was max 2248 my downward max movement of 1648. Then I checked out Fight Simulator 2004. As stated the plane could barely get off the ground, but good braking and a good ground run, just could not get the plane to take off.
Also, I was wondering, how does one hook-up multiple axis "Y" & "X" on a single Delink, or are two Delinks in order?

jsmith2307

Greetings,
Testing continues, in Simtools 1.2 on the output testing page, Axis testing pitch was +5 upward travel and - 22 on downward travel.
jsmith2307

Fantastic to hear you have had success @jsmith2307 ! I think you’re kangaroo is operating normally and it is your tune that again is at fault with the movement you have. Use my program and start and press home on a motor to center it. Use a voltmeter to check what the output voltage on its feedback pot is at this time. It should be 2.5 volts because 2.5 volts always equals center position. Therefore, when you start your tuning next time, if you want the up and down movement from center position to be equal, then your pots tuning limits must be equally up from 2.5 volts and equally down from 2.5 volts. Then make sure your pot is right at 2.5 volts again before you start tuning. This should make your up and down movements equal.

To control both x and y motors from one delink and simtools you simply send 1,p<Axis> for motor one to respond or 2,p<Axis> for motor two to respond.