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Experimental DCS Plugin ready for testing

Discussion in 'Digital Combat Simulators (DCS)' started by Dirty, Jun 28, 2019.

  1. hexpod

    hexpod http://heXpod.xyz

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    Although LPF and HPF combinations (algorithms) are kind of standard for a Stewart platforms I understand that for the pressure device like a g-vest the HPF is a no-go.

    It can be that for your application you would be happy with a simple 1 subtracted from the vertical g-load.
  2. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    Maybe you could try FlyPT Mover.
    Published a new version today. There's still some bugs, but you have more "power" on the filters, and you can define two pose calculations with different setups and send one for the rig and another for the g vest.
    You can also define direct connections of a variable to an actuator and apply a filter has you want.
    Actuators are in the number you need. just give it a key/name, a bit range value and use it in the output string.

    It's a modular system. Add what you need.
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  3. gianlu320

    gianlu320 Member

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    Did anybody try to use this plugin using only simtools?
    Do we need any other program like flyPT mover to make it work properly?
    I ask this because I've never used anything else other than simtools and I'm afraid things would be even more complicated.
    Am I wrong?
  4. SeatTime

    SeatTime Well-Known Member

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    Yes.
  5. gianlu320

    gianlu320 Member

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    @SeatTime
    Sorry but dont understand..
    Yes you tried to use the plugin with no other software other than simtools?
    Or
    Yes we need another software to run this on top of simtools?
  6. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    FlyPT Mover is a stand alone program.
    It gets data directly from games, but can also get data from SimTools.
    When I get to my PC I will explain better the differences.
  7. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    @gianlu320

    So what we have:

    -SimTools.
    -The plugin for SimTools in this topic. There is already a plugin for DCS, but this one includes some extra info.
    -Nutkicker by @Dirty, that works standalone. It's for now made to use with DCS and hexapods (linear and developing for rotating also)
    I think the last version get's data directly from DCS.

    Then you have what I made:
    -FlyPT Hexapod interface, that's old now and replaced by Mover.
    -FlyPT Hexapod plugins for SimTools. Those are similar to what we have in FlyPT Hexapod. Only advantage in the application is that you can connect directly to some games without SimTools.
    They come with the last version of SimTools.
    -And my new FlyPT Mover. Works similar to FlyPT Hexapod, but it's modular. We can mix effects, it has an advanced filtering system, it already includes modules for other rigs besides hexapods, and many different features.

    What is the main difference between SimTools and my applications?
    SimTools makes positioning of actuators empirically. What I mean is: You select the amount you want to apply to one actuator for a specific variable you get from the game.
    While in my programs, we pick all the data and reproduce the motion on the rig. Since we can't have a 1:1 reproduction, we need to use the motion cueing algorithm.
    With the plugin I made, you have it in Simtools, but only for hexapods.

    Just give a try to the other applications. They are free and they wont affect SimTools. Don't want them, just erase their files.

    Defending a bit my Mover :blush, imagine the following:

    I'm using it in RFactor2. So I have RFactor2 as a source.
    From that source I can generate for example 3 motions:
    #1 from the suspension travel
    #2 vibration from the motor rpm
    #3 from the car movement
    Then I add them all on my rig (or I can use just one).
    I can also get the speed and send it directly to an output to move a fan and make wind and/or send it to another output and move a servo to make speedo.
    Same for rpm...

    Other example that I'm working right now:
    In XPlane11 I have two sources, one for ground another for air.
    I generate two separated motions with different filtering for each one.
    Then I add them to use in the rig.
    This allows us to make different behaviours on the rig.
    With the help of @hexpod , I'm also adding stall today.
    If the plane enters in stall, the rig starts vibrating. This is made with a module that calculates noise depending on the value of a variable.
    It can be used with any variable.
    Beside this we can also add motor vibration from the rpm...

    As you can see it has many possibilities. Might look confusing at start, but when you understand the logic, everything becomes clear.
    The hardest part is to understand how to use the filters.
    I'm working on a manual, and I might give it priority on this topic.
    • Informative Informative x 2
  8. gianlu320

    gianlu320 Member

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    @pmvcda

    Thanks a lot for the explanation
    I will try it and see if I make sense of it
  9. Dirty

    Dirty Active Member Gold Contributor

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    I'd second that in bold font with CAPITAL LETTERS!!! :) Understanding filters is the key to motion cueing.

    FlyPT_Mover is great and it will allow you to apply the filters needed to drive your platform. The modular design is great and will let users tailor their own motion cueing however desired. If @pmvcda had started a few months earlier, I probably wouldn't even have started with Nutkicker in the first place. :)

    So for a clean, reliable and simple solution -->use FlyPT_Mover either directly or with data coming from SimTools.
    Only if someone is really interested in diving into the matter a little deeper, likes to do some coding or needs a rig geometry that is a bit "off the beaten track"--> my software is all open source. You can code anything you want into it :thumbs I'd be happy to help anyone to get started.

    Cheers,... Dirty :)
  10. gianlu320

    gianlu320 Member

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    Thanks all for your answers
    I downloaded FlyPT_Mover this afternoon and had a look at it.
    For the moment i'm still in the darkness but I'm trying to make sense of it
  11. SeatTime

    SeatTime Well-Known Member

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    Yes, just simtools.
  12. Dani

    Dani New Member Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Tested with YAW VR motion sim. I need further testing and tweak but it handles better than the oficial one. Barrel rolls and Loops feel better and no need of any filter or anti rollover.
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  13. gianlu320

    gianlu320 Member

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    @pmvcda
    and @anybodyelse who understands these complicated pieces of software

    I think I need some help with this experimental plugin and Flypt Mover
    I downloaded Flypt, and installed the dll inside simtools plus I installed the DCS experimental plugin in simtools and patched plus I added the Flypt Mover export.lua lines of code inside DCS export lua.

    The experimental plugin works properly and I see the extra values (on ground, ias and aoa) in tuning center.
    Flypt-Mover is correctly connected and receives data from the sim.
    Now my problems start..., I don't really know what I'm doing here.
    I've tried to work on one dof at a time, and I started with roll.
    According to Flypt_Mover thread roll is axis5a in simtools and in that thread there is a picture showing simtools with roll set on axis5a in Dof1 (I don't know why dof1)
    I've set my simtools according to that picture so on dof1 I've set axis5a as roll.
    But in this way I have no motion on roll.
    Then I've set my axis1a and axis2a dof5 as I would normally do for roll in simtools leaving also roll in axis5a dof1.
    Now I have motion in roll and if I adjust values in Flypt_Mover (poses) I see that the motion behavior changes.
    In filters I've set EMAHP as I've read this should be done for pitch and roll but I don't know exactly what that value is under it 100.000 comes as default value.
    I also don't understand how Gain in and Gain out work, I've tried to randomly change those values and I can see that the platform behavior changes but for the life of me i can't understand how they work and what exactly changing these numbers does.
    I've also configured and connected output in Flypt_mover
    So first question is....
    Did I properly configure simtools and Flypt_Mover together with simtools axis and dof?
    Can you explain a bit how things change when changing all those parameters like gain in/out and values in filters?
    I'm sorry for the long and messy post but at the moment I am so confused that I don't even know if this post makes sense at all.

    I forgot to mention one thing, I have roll dialled in some way, and it feels even good somewhat even if it's not perfect.
    The problem is that it feels good from 300 kts and above.
    Below 300 kts the roll becomes unresponsive and at approach speeds I basically don't have any motion so the landing feels non natural at all because I have no motion.

    Thanks a lot to anybody willing to help.
  14. gianlu320

    gianlu320 Member

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    I realize my previous post is a bit messy and difficult to understand..
    I will ask only one question then, and I will take it from there.
    On Flypt-Mover thread this is what is stated:
    Copy-paste..

    The values show in FlyPT Mover this way:

    - Lateral acceleration equal to Axis1a (-100 to 100 m/s^2)
    - Longitudinal acceleration equal to Axis2a (-100 to 100 m/s^2)
    - Vertical acceleration equal to Axis3a (-100 to 100 m/s^2)
    - Yaw position equal to Axis4a (-180 to 180º)
    - Roll position equal to Axis5a (-180 to 180º)
    - Pitch position equal to Axis6a (-180 to 180º)

    Now my question is, talking about roll..
    I only have 3 axis on my motion platform.
    Axis1a, Axis2a (front left and right actuators) and Axis3a (rear center actuator).
    So I configured my simtools DOF5 Axis1a and Axis2a as roll
    How can I display roll position in Flypt_Mover?

    I hope that this makes sense because knowing the answer would really help me understand how to use Flypt_Mover

    Edit...
    Maybe I just understood one thing
    Flypt_mover plugin for simtools is valid only for exapods, Is that correct?
    If this is correct than I am left only with one option if I want to use Flypt_Mover that is using Flypt_mover directly without simtools?
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2019
  15. pmvcda

    pmvcda aka FlyPT

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    You are mixing everything... :)

    The idea of connecting Mover to SimTools, is now, just a way of getting compatibility with more games.
    If you have a direct connection in Mover, it's faster, and there's no need for tuning center.
    To use Mover, it's better to use it's sources, unless you are using other SimTools features.

    SimTools get's data from a game and then you mix/filter that data in each axis to accomplish a move in your axis (axis is the actuator).
    Now if you want to use SimTools data in Mover, we don't want any mixing or filtering made in SimTools (you can, but it's better/simpler to avoid it).
    You will always have the tuning center changing that data, but you can't avoid it.
    To get the data in Mover, we send it through each axis, like you said above.
    But the idea is to uses for example, just roll in axis5a. There in the mixing you put just 100% roll on the axis5a
    Then the Mover plugin inside Simtools, sends the axis values to a shared memory file that is read by Mover.
    Mover picks that data and knows that for axis5a it's roll, and uses it as roll. If you mixed anything in Simtools, Mover still think's it's just roll.

    From there, you use mover the same for any rig.
    In Mover what you do is get all the data and filter it to generate movement in your rig. If your rig has no Yaw, then data generated for yaw is not used.
    Same for roll.

    What kind of rig do you have? 3DOF with 4 linear actuators?

    EDIT:
    Sorry, I have been busy this last days, so I'm not giving the attention I should.
    For Mover problems, I would prefer you to post in that topic, or pu my name as @pmvcda,
    so I get a notification.
    I will try to explain all this better in the manual I'm making.

    Like I said, you don't need SimTools to use DCS in Mover, use the direct connection.
    • Informative Informative x 1
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2019
  16. PetroVitallini

    PetroVitallini Member

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    Hello!

    I've been trying to get dcs to work with my prosimu 4 actuator rig and has stumbled on some hurdles. I have movement in the rig. I'm using generic 2d advanced as that is what you are supposed to use with a flight sim, correct? I have sway, surge, pitch, roll and heave on my dof's. Each one at 20 % making the total axis allocation 100%. No filters activated at this time. I assume with this plugin I don't need the anti-roll ticked when using the experimental plugin.

    The problem I'm having is that when I do a roll in dcs, for some reason while simtools is active, it affects my joystick input. I believe it only happens when doing aggressive and fast rolls, but if I pull the stick to the right, the plane in the sim does about a 45 degree roll and then it stops and ignores my joystick input. I let it up and roll again and I can do another 45 degree roll. Can anyone educate me as to what is going on here? Is this in any way related to the washout filther?
  17. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR - The Next Generation Staff Member Moderator

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    I have not used this plugin, but the situation you describe is where washout is traditionally used, which if set correctly should slowly roll the sim back below perception levels to allow more roll than the rig is physically capable of.
  18. SeatTime

    SeatTime Well-Known Member

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    :confused:
    I have used this plug-in, worked fine for me (apart from the heave offset) with no issues with my joystick or anything else. Maybe a port issue, but maybe not :confused:.
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2019
  19. Trip Rodriguez

    Trip Rodriguez VR Pilot

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    Yeah that's really bizarre! I've never heard of an issue like yours. Have you tried moving the joystick to a different USB port (preferably one that's being run by a different controller) and other things like that?

    If the simulator is plugged in and powered on but simtools isn't active the problem is not present?
  20. PetroVitallini

    PetroVitallini Member

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    Ok, it seems like a usb usb change and/or re-boot fixed this. Weird problem. Thank you all for chiming in!

    @SeatTime do you know why there is this heave offset? Taking account for gravity or something like that?