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Showroom 6DoF Winch Motor Flight Sim Platform

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Projects' started by Historiker, Sep 21, 2013.

  1. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    Never said you were wrong Rob, just that I do not agree that "don't see it happening" statement ;)

    Never say never my friend.

    I give you full props for the many innovations and excellent aid that you have given over the years. My own 2DoF would not be here without you.
  2. eaorobbie

    eaorobbie Well-Known Member Staff Member SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    Ya cool man no offense taken.
    Sorry for the comment hopefully drives ya to complete it.
    Yes I have built a saris link on to a winch but did not improve the weight handling still failed with large heave
    movements. And Aldoz unit wound not work with out the spring to support(balance) the weight.
    The key is balance in all sim builds ,2-6DOF, maybe you will come up with a better method.
    Hex pod could be the answer.
    Again sorry for the harsh remark.
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    No worries, I didn't take it harshly at all. Without constructive criticism we cannot create innovations.

    I am actually 50/50 on whether it will work or not. But I would rather start with what I want (dream) and work backward to accomplish what I can rather than redoing the entire thing over and over working my way up.

    I would like to know more about your experience with winch motors and sarrus hinges.
    I have my bearings, armatures and mounts saved up in a box but have not yet put anything together with a winch. I did make one once with one of the 24v motors that I have but as you mention it was not a success. But I rather think that had more to do with the quality of the motor rather than the hinge.

    When you mention failure with large heave movement; are you talking about speed or range of motion?

    Thanks again for your help Rob, I really appreciate it.
  4. eaorobbie

    eaorobbie Well-Known Member Staff Member SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    sorry man about all thats left of that project a cad picture.
    stdwinchbody.png
  5. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Here is a short video of the test platform in miniature that I built today. Mostly I wanted to do a proof of concept that would allow me to work with 6DoF setups in SimTools.

    The servos are Futaba 148 types (also known as 3003) controlled by an Arduino UNO and and edited version of Eaorobbies excellent servo motion platform sketch. I changed the servo names from R and L to A, B, C, D, E, F etc.

    Tested in Simtools by changing the default assignments (axis) it worked perfectly by changing the slider positions for each DoF. In the game of DCS P-51 however I noticed that heave, roll, pitch and yaw worked but surge and sway did not seem to. It might have been that I just did not see them with the other movements and of course I did not remember to let it adjust the min/max settings. I might redo the video at some point after I do that.

    All together I am very happy with this test. Simtools works flawlessly and is simple to set up!

    • Like Like x 3
  6. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Another video showing manipulation of the DoF sliders in Simtool output test window:

    • Like Like x 4
  7. eaorobbie

    eaorobbie Well-Known Member Staff Member SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    Well done indeed, as I stated you have taught me something, we had hoped that the servo code my lead to something like this.
    Blown away, keep up the effort mate.
    • Like Like x 2
  8. RacingMat

    RacingMat Well-Known Member Gold Contributor

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    Very well done! That's really exciting!!

    6 winches, Simtools and ready to go!
    :)
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    I have been reevaluating my decision to use winch motors. Mostly based on the amount of noise that they create. It is really distracting while driving and while flying it would be much worse at x3.

    With that in mind I tinkered with my 2DoF winch motors and found that if I removed the cable guides (not needed anymore) I got rid of the "clanging" completely. I then bored out the motor mounts allowing me to adjust the gear lash. A local friend is a mechanical engineer and with his advice I set the gap (not the term he used, I forget what it was) between the teeth on the motor gear (shaft) and the follower gear (124 tooth). Almost all of the gear noise is now gone.

    The winch motors are so much quieter now. There is of course still noise, I cannot get rid of it completely but compared to what it was this is a huge improvement.

    I am going to go ahead with the build, but probably not until this winter.
    • Like Like x 2
  10. bsft

    bsft

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    thats interesting about the winch motor noise mod, do you have anymore details?
  11. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    I will try to get some pictures, hopefully I can start buying more motors soon. Just have to get several other projects finished first.

    Basically you just have to make the motor adjustable. By boring out the mounting holes for both the screws and the motor neck (where the motor joins the winch body) you can adjust the gear lash where they mesh together. Out of the box they are very loose and this induces skipping and slapping between the shaft teeth and the gear teeth. That was the "clatter".

    The winches are by no means silent, most would say that they are still noisy, but compared to what they were they are so much better.

    The "clanging" was the worst, and that was fixed by removing the cable guides. That took complete dissassembly of the winch gears and then I had to drive the center shaft out one side after removing a lock ring. After I removed the cable guides I put the shaft back in to help keep the winch assembly solid.
    • Like Like x 1
  12. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
    DC motor, Arduino, Motion platform, 6DOF
    A fellow member has asked me for my axis configuration for 6DoF so they can use it in their own experiments with Simtools.

    Here are both the Axes Config and the interface Config. I included the interface so he could see how I have my axes lettered A-F. This will not work for everyone as they may be using more than one controller or their axes naming convention might be different. It is just an example.

    The same is true of the axes themselves of course. If you have a different motor configuration or your motors are reversed from what I have you will have to tinker around with them.

    Included is a picture of how I have my servo motors configured and which way is forward (notice the plane drawing on top of the platform).

    The best help would really be a video showing which motors lift the platform, which stay stationary and which lower the platform for each degree of freedom. I have so little time these days that I doubt I will be able to get to that any time soon, sorry.

    As far as axis percentages I just set everything to 60% on each axis for testing.

    Once I have a usable full scale platform I will post more detailed profile settings, etc.

    IMG_0531[1].JPG IMG_0532[1].JPG

    Axis Settings DOF one two and three.png Axis Settings DOF four five and six.png

    Attached Files:

    • Like Like x 3
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    Last edited: Nov 29, 2013
  13. NjMotion

    NjMotion Active Member Gold Contributor

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    Wow! perfect! great work Historiker.
    Hi all, next week I start my project 6DOF with small engines and if all goes well the other biggest change.
    Historiker is helping me to start well. Thanks friend.
    I will post here the progress of the project.
  14. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    Oh no you don't.....don't blame me! ;)

    Everyone is responsible for their own addiction, lol.
    • Like Like x 3
  15. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
    DC motor, Arduino, Motion platform, 6DOF
    I picked up two more winchs today at Menards. For those who are not familiar with them; Menards is a big box hardware store that carries everything from construction material to milk and breakfast cereal.

    Price was great, 64.99 each with 11% off. They only had two in stock and you cannot use the 11% for rainchecks.

    The winches are an in-house brand made in Minnesota. Same specs as the rest but slighly smaller footprint. The gears (cogs are individual teeth on a gear) are solid machined steel not stamped and riveted plates like the MasterLocks that I have.

    I am slowly gathering more items. I need to get with RacingMat and test out a few ideas for his Arduino code, then I will start welding my frame up. The footprint will be significantly smaller than my 2DoF ;)

    At this point I plan on sharing the PC for both platforms.

    Give me another six months or so and I might have more to show ;)
    • Like Like x 3
  16. RaceRay

    RaceRay Administrator Staff Member SimAxe Beta Tester

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    Don´t you dare! :D I dont want to wait six months to see more progress...:cool:
    (Its scaring how fast time flies...its really nearly 4 months ago since your project started:think)
  17. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Most of my time wasted has been on teaching/grading/real jobs/family/christmas.....now if I could only do away with those.....NAAAA. :D
    • Funny Funny x 2
  18. Historiker

    Historiker Dramamine Adict Staff Member Moderator Gold Contributor

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    My Motion Simulator:
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    Slowly getting parts together to complete this build.

    I have all of the winch motors (thanks to the Menards 11% off sale), gears, steel, Heim joints, steel pipe, and Arduino microcontrollers that I need.

    Still need two more 10k 10-turn pots, two more motor drivers (looking at the cheap Chinese drivers that RufusDufus points out in his Arduino thread).

    I made these today to connect the potentiometers to the gears: (see Rene? I am dragging and dropping my pictures directly into Xsimulator, happy? :grin) IMG_0583.JPG IMG_0584.JPG IMG_0582.JPG
    • Informative Informative x 1
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  19. RaceRay

    RaceRay Administrator Staff Member SimAxe Beta Tester

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    Great to see you are doing progress and i am very delighted about your dragged and dropped images mate;)
  20. bsft

    bsft

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    looks good man