Winch Motors?

Curious what folks have to say about a few low cost winches I've found on Amazon. I'm looking at a 2/3 dof platform, potentially similar to AldoZ http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/my-3dof-project-is-born-t3096.html

Thanks!

Hi!, please be sure to buy a winch with ONE WAY friction gear. This is very important because if you buy a TWO WAY friction gear winch so you will face the problem about your winch can't mantain the position under effort because you can't narrow and lock the friction gears! (the effort to beat the gravity or the effort to beat the resistance of the spring).

With one way friction winch so you will be able to LOCK (I am using 2 reversed and narrow well bolts) your friction gears and this will help you to have a platform that can hold the position with less effort and sufference from the winch motor!.

Legenda:
ONE WAY FRICTION GEAR WINCH = the winch with the remote control with only ONE command button (the command to recover the cable ) and with the hand crank to release the cable.

TWO WAY FRICTION GEAR WINCH = the one with remote control with 2 command buttons. The recover cable and release cable buttons.

:hi:

Thats an interesting point there. I am wondering if because the worm gear motors are two way friction, they have to work harder, unlike your winch motors.
Then again, the winches are designed to pull a boat, unlike my big worm gear motors.

AldoZ,

I'm looking at this one from Northern Ind. Looks like you can get parts for it too if needed.
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200381758_200381758

Exploded view towards end of manual:
http://www.northerntool.com/downloads/manuals/141220.pdf

Does this appear to use the one way plate?

Would the platform be driven off of the hand crank arm ?

Is it possible to use the winch with the plastic case installed? As long as you have a way to drive the pot (thinking safety/kids and to keep debris out of the gearbox)


Your sim looks awesome! How much pitch, roll, heave are you measuring?

Have you tried a flight sim with your setup at all?

Thanks!
Scott

@bsft: Hi mate, never like in this situation I understand how many my english sucks....
In poor words, a little example:

we take a look on the LEFT winch ok? The simulation start, the game run, and in the flow of the time X-SIM give the orders to the Jrk...
In a precision instant the left winch is with no order, it had reach the last position and it in waiting for the next command.
In this istance with a ONE WAY winch with the friction narrow well so the winch CAN hold this position.. (in this example we take the situation that the left winch is near the top lowest position so there is the central spring that try to put UP the platform forcing the winch to go UP!!. But the winch friction is narrow well so it's the friction that make this resistance versus the spring and not the motor!!!!! (so less motor sufference!)

In this same case if I use a TWO way winch so the motor will not have this micro pause of work! It will try to beat the spring force and it will try to correct the UP force provided by the spring with a new opposite work movement.....

RESULT:
With a TWO WAY friction winch you can't STOP THE PLATFORM and mantain the actual position because the motors are OFF. The motors always must be OPERATIVE AND under effort for make a continuos correction of position because the gravity and spring forces are ALWAYS working.

With a ONE way friction winch you can STOP the platform with the spring into hard pressure or with a big guy seat on platform, without motors help. The platform will mantain the actual position, helping very much the motors and reducing the motor effort!.

When you drag a boat you don't need to have a one way friction winch, 'cause you have not to do a vertical work but an horizontal work that don't need you better to have a ONE WAY friction winch.
Original work for a winch (drag cars and boats) don't need the 3dof typology work.
And for an original work for a winch you better to have 2 buttons for get out and in the cable too!! )



@boosted-lt1:
Does this appear to use the one way plate?
I don't know.. you can obtain this information from the winch manual. It's hard to find this information in the internet sites.

Would the platform be driven off of the hand crank arm ?
My platform use 3 ONE WAY WINCHES so these 3 winches are already narrow well so when I have to edit manually the position I have to move with my hand the gear where the pot is mounted.

Is it possible to use the winch with the plastic case installed? As long as you have a way to drive the pot (thinking safety/kids and to keep debris out of the gearbox)
In my situation NOT. I heavly custom my winches and I can't to use the original plastic box. I am trying to build 3 new boxes to put inside the winches to reduce the noises and dangers too!

Your sim looks awesome! How much pitch, roll, heave are you measuring?
Thank you a lot dude! lateral and longitudinal inclinations are near to 30°. I can obtain more but more mean get more near to obtain a over max or min values so I think with actual mechanical configuration I reach the final numbers


Have you tried a flight sim with your setup at all?
Yeah dude!!!! I am in collaboration with a my friend that he is a Ryanair Boeing 737 captain pilot and we are working to make a great profile for FSX!!!! I am working hard for IL-2 too but I find a very sad thing about this game plugin : You can't obtain the longitudinal accelleration very sad because this variable is vital to obtain a correct math calcs for a realistic profile!


I hope so and so you can understand what I am writing The battle with my english is lose from a lot of time (

That's too bad about IL2 - one of my favorite sims. If you have any videos with FSX in action I'd love to check it out 8)

Hello Aldoz. I understand how a winch motor set up works. I am just comparing to what i use. Your motor setup has 2 gears to the output. Mine has a worm gear to the output. Probably the same overall speed at the lever. I am just saying, that a winch may be better set up for lift in your application.

Hello AldoZ, bsft, and all,

Here is an exploded view of the winch I'm looking at. Does this look like a good candidate? I see it uses 2 friction plates on the main gear, a manual knob to adjust clutch friction, and a locking claw. I believe it is a one way design, but not 100% clear.

Thank you!

It looks like the one similar to Aldoz and Eaorobbies motors. Chaps, please advise.

I am thinking of investing in a winch motor. Aldoz' comment about some motors not holding position worried me as I am unfamiliar with winches. Below are the specs of a winch I'm considering. I've highlighted the particulars which I hope make it a suitable candidate.

Does this answer Aldoz' concerns about ONE WAY FRICTION?

1. Power in and Power out
2. Automatic load Holding Brake
3. Big power motor
4. Free spooling Clutch for Fast Wire Rope Payout
5. Quiet, Efficient, Full Metal 3-Stage Planetary gear box
6. Waterproof Winch
7. Heavy Duty Sealed Contactor

Specification

• Rated Line Pull: 4000Lbs single line
• Motor: DC 12V – 1.6HP/1.2KW output
• Gear Train: 3 Stage planetary
• Gear Ratio: 198:1
• Clutch: Sliding Ring Gear
• Braking Action: Automatic in the drum
• Fairlead: 4-Way Roller Fairlead
• Wire Rope: 6mm × 10m
• Drum Size: 50mm × 76.5mm
• Dimensions: 347.9mm × 116.2mm × 114mm
• Bolt Pattern: 124mm × 76mm

Hey FC, I am not really sure what he means by "Two Way". I used a couple of the cheap Master Lock winches listed in the first post for my 2DoF build with no problems whatsoever with concern of holding position. When there is no power it is possible to get them to move one way or the other if you use a great deal of force. I do not believe that the planetary gear type winches do not work well but this is just having read other people experiences and not my own. The winches that I, and everyone else as far as I can tell, are easy to mount, convert and use. I modded mine slightly to make them quieter. You can see more detailed pictures of my winches in my build thread here:

http://www.xsimulator.net/community...o-steel-motion-rig-24v-big-motors.4603/page-8

Historiker,

Thanks for the response but I'm a little confused.

The double negative got me. Does this mean you think that the winch I'm considering is okay? Here are the full specs:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Wireless...=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f0ab3327a

By the way, Historiker, your final rig is great. The video is tossing you about like a rag doll! Well done. Your persistence is admirable. Can you tell us a little more about your gear mod? Did you file the valley between the teeth of the nylon gear or the metal gear?

Cheers,

Flying Colander

lol, sorry buddy. I am tired.

I do not believe that planetary geared motors will work for motion platforms.

As to the mod, I ground down the motor mount holes so I could adjust the gear lash between the motor output shaft (which has gear teeth in it) and the follower gear. They were too loose resulting in skipping and lash noise. I also removed the cable guides which were just large metal washers but if left in place without the cable (which is removed when you adapt the winches for your platform) they clang really loud when the winch is working. There was no need to file the teeth on either gear as the nylon gear (which is intended for R/C heli use) is exactly the right size.

The videos that I posted are of my winches before I modded them. I need to get another video created to show the difference. I have not had any time to use the platform in a month or so though



EDIT: What I said above about planetary geared motors is rubbish. Pit and others have well proven me wrong with their motion platforms and I am not at all sorry to say that I was wrong. Just for future builders who might look at this thread.

No worries! Thanks for taking the time to follow up.

To review: winch with planetary gears, yes, not working!

Yes the winches can be a little noisy but as @Historiker has shown they can be made a little quieter. Planetary winches have been tried, they are even noisier again and a lot more expensive. Myself I do not worry about sim moving if there is no power, like the big worm gear units we use, basically ensure the sim is turned on and in game before jumping on and off and when finished , turning the sim off results in it sitting back to a rest position, no big deal to me.

Which winch?

Can anyone recommend some reasonably priced, non-planetary winches which are available in Australia?

Ta,

Flying Colander

They are a generic boat winch mate, check Repco and BCF dont think Supercheap stock them anymore, or Ebay them.

Thanks, eaorobbie.

Found them at REPCO for $99, on sale now. Part no. GBW2000. BCF doesn't seem to carry them nor Supercheap. Good tip, mate.

Ah cool I got one ages ago from Supercheap , but they didnt have anymore, need one more to bring my old Joyrider back to life as soon as the SimAxe turns up. Nice to know Repco have them for the same cost I paid for my first, 4 years ago. Thanks

ragazzi, secondo voi questi potrebbero andar bene per un 6dof? Magari nella discussione è tutto ben sponline non è sempre chiaro
http://www.ebay.it/itm/121135238929?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649


guys, do you think these might be fine for a 6dof? Maybe the discussion is all nicely sponline it is not always clear
http://www.ebay.it/itm/121135238929?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649