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Wheight distribuition and some question

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Building Q&A / FAQ' started by AldoZ, Oct 28, 2010.

  1. AldoZ

    AldoZ Member

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    Hello all.
    You can see the image posted.

    You can notice 4 SCN6 40kg - 300mm stroke actuators mounted in the extreme edge of all 4 angles.
    The square platform has a weight of 140kg.

    Please correct me if i write somethings wrong:

    1) These are 2 of the actuators infos:
    A) Max thrust (N)/(kgf) = 400/40.8
    B) Push mode max. Thrust (N)/(kgf) = 280/28.5

    Ok, in first, what is the difference between Max thrust and push mode? I need just a basic explanation about it!

    2) what mean Radial Load Capacity (N) = 12 ?
    What mean this info? I understand that much longer the rod is and less is the Radial load capacity. Much longer the rod is and less wheight can it handle?

    3) Looking my posted image you can see the first example. All my 4 actuators are attached at the ground, so,my actuators can't move/roteate their main body. They are static on the ground, they can just extend or retract their rods.
    Then, my 4 actuators are both 40kg max thrust and the total of the sum of my 4 actuators max thrust is 160kgf.
    (Remember, my platform is 140kg weight). So, looking the posted image, can these actuators move my platform up and down without big troubles?

    4) Are my 4 actuators in the correct position for share perfectly the wheight of the platform? theorically Both actuators will have 35kg of wheight to handle.(140kg / 4)

    5) Look at the second example in the posted picture. Actuators 1 and 2 retract their rods to 0% and the actuators 3 and 4 extract their rod to 100%. After that, have both the actuators 1 and 2 to mantain the 35kg? or the inclination of the platform change the wheight distribuition? Maybe in this situation the actuiators 1 and 2 have to support a major wheight?

    For now it's all, thank you in advance.

    Attached Files:

  2. bvillersjr

    bvillersjr Active Member

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    I'm assuming that there is some kind of universal joint in the middle somewhere to act as a pivot point and remove some of the load from the actuators?

    What is the purpose of the sim? Racing or Flight?

    The 40Kgf rating is the maximum, which in terms of a linear actuators means that 40Kgf is available at a very slow speed. Please check the speed / torque graph for the SCN6. Depending on what speed your sim needs to have, you can determine via the chart how many Kgf will be available at that speed of operation.

    Radial load is the amount of load side-to-side load that the actuator rod can handle when fully entended. The assumed universal joint helps you here as well.

    Without a universal joint, your actuators are definitely NOT sharing the load. In the case of of a turn, the design you illustrated puts all of the load plus inertia on just two actuators. The pivot point would assist this because then two actuators could push while two pulled.
  3. AldoZ

    AldoZ Member

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    Hello bvillersjr, in first thank you for answer.
    So:
    The platform in the example it's a 3DOF platform. I think you speak about a SPRING as a pivot. You can see in the new posted picture that i put a spring under my platform at the center of the platform shape. Can this be right to continue to use my 4 SCN6 40kgf actuators as 3DOF platform?

    The purpose is something that will ok for both. SCN6 40kg have a speed of 200mm/seconds (extract and retract the rod)and i think this speed is not too bad for Flight sim and Racing sim too. The your next quote speak about that probably.

    Ok, so if i understand, the speed of the rod depend on the weight the rod have to handle. More weight = Less speed. Then, is 200mm/sec the speed without load?

    Mmm maybe i understand but i not too sure.. Can you teach me about what you mean when you write amount of load side-to-side?
    This value in this case for my SCN6 actuator is 12. So maybe 12 are the kg that this actuator can handle with the rod full extracted?

    Ok please, take a look to my posted picture. As you can see, in the example1, the 4 actuators share the same wheight (example 35) thank to the central spring as pivot too. Right?
    And in the example 2 the actuators number 1 and 2 get more weight to handle. So i correctly understand what you mean?

    In finish, can be realistic to think about a 3DOF platform like in my picture just using 4 SCN6 40kg or 60kg actuators?

    Thank you very much!

    Attached Files:

  4. Frakk

    Frakk Active Member

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    Radial load: Load that pushes the actuator sideways, perpendicular to the direction of the ball screw. Put the SCN actuator on it's side, rod extending horizontally from a table or a flat surface for example. Put weight on the rod end and that is radial load. In the SCN6's case, you can put 12kg on it before it breaks.

    A spring is not going to work under the platform. It will not prevent the platform from twisting, neither from side movements and it will not be stable in the 3DOF.

    You need a fixed pivot point in the middle on top of the spring. This pivot point can only move in the vertical direction.

    More precisely with stepper motors, increasing their speed will greatly reduce their torque. The rating of 40kgf is the maximum torque generated when the actuator is standing still. As soon as it starts speeding up, the torque drops significantly. As you can see, the SCN6-040 will offer the best torque-speed curve, maintaining 20kgf at 75mm/sec, the -050 and -060 drop in torque very suddenly as speed increases.

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  5. AldoZ

    AldoZ Member

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    Thank you Frakk. Now the situation it's really more clear.
    And from all these informations, i think the chaches to do a 3DOF with the SCN6 actuators are really little.

    I would really to do a 3DOF platform but i have to consider the limitations of these electrical actuators. And these limitations are very much. I read about the pneumatic cylinder, they are really power, they can push hundred kg at really good speed (if i read right) and the price remain more or less the same of the SCN6 actuators. But the things needed for use the pneumatic cylinder are many, (compressor, valves ecc) and sure i can't think to use the SimExperience SX-4000 with these pneumatic cylinder. (more, i read that pneumatic cylinder has not a good precision) .Then the pneumatic actuators are a very complex matter too.

    A little question :
    I see many 3/6 DOF examples on the net and i see they use motors with a rotor. In this rotor is mounted a piece of iron and this piece of iron is attached to the structure (sorry for my basic english...). So, what this the name of this motors? are they like the R-Series Servo Motors? Or the R-Series Servo Motors are a different thing (less power?)
    And can i use these motors or Servo motors instead the SCN6 if i will use the SimExperience SX-4000? (are compatibles?)

    Thank you guys
  6. bvillersjr

    bvillersjr Active Member

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    The SX-3000 and SX-4000 are not compatible with pneumatic actuators or random DC motors. They are purpose designed for the intelligent controllers included with the SCN series of actuators.

    Given the mass and mechanics you are presenting, the SCN6 will not work for you.
  7. AldoZ

    AldoZ Member

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    Thank a lot dudes. I received all the information i needed for now!
  8. matstumpf

    matstumpf New Member

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    My Motion Simulator:
    2DOF, SCN5
    Sorry about reviving this thread, but i'm searching for the software to control a platform like these.
    What i have:
    Arduino, SimTools, 4x IBT2, 4x actuators each one in the edges of the platform.

    Does anybody know what code for the arduino and also the wiring diagram?

    Thanks a lot guys!
  9. bsft

    bsft

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    @matstumpf , please start a new thread and ask from there.