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Powerful and low cost 220V motor & driver

Discussion in 'Motor actuators and drivers' started by Oms, Feb 11, 2018.

  1. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    I propose in this post an idea of motor that can be used to move a simulator with the particularity to be low cost and to provide a high power in the 2 rotation directions. I think it is not already discussed in the forums xsimulator, but in this case tell me and I will supress the post.
    The weaknesses are just the rotation speed which is high (> 10000 rpm) so the torque is low, and the noise (so to be packaged with noise insulation). There are several mechanical solution for gear reducing, but which I will not present here.
    The motor is an universal motor of washing machine (used motors can be buy for a few dollars/Euros and after changing the brushes it is getting new !).
    The power is several hundred Watts (until 1 kW). Here attached I found (qty 2), only 300W but enough to do test.

    As there are universal, you can use 220V AC or DC. In this case, that becomes easy to control it using a diodes bridge to transform 220V ac in 220V dc, then a simple H bridge.
    Here attached electric diagram of my motor
    I begins to design the H bridge and will give you rapidly the progress (I draw my own circuit, then I will design the PCB)

    . universal motor photo.jpg universal motor v2.jpg
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  2. Thanos

    Thanos Active Member

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    What is the acceleration of such motors? Also from the rotor size they look like will have lots of inertia and will be hard to stop...
  3. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    It is well considered Thanos.
    I have proceeded to a off-load test, and in fact the acceleration is very high, but the current also ... (above the nominal current). As the duration is short to reach a high speed, perhaps this is not damaging for the motor to have this short time overcurrent (it is more the average current that is important, because of the thermal heating of the internal wires).
    I think I will control the speed but also the current, and allow short time overcurrent.
    To change the direction of the rotation, I will also allow to power the motors in the reverse direction, so autorize overcurrent (I will limit a lot the pwm in this case; until the tachymeter indicate a low speed then a reversion).

    All that are theoritical, only the true test will validate or not the interest of this kind of motor for car simulator (I think that for Aircraft, we can accept slower speed pitch, roll, yaw...)
  4. Gadget999

    Gadget999 Active Member

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    so the motors have no magnets and the coil produces the magnetic field !

    i am guessing a lot of current and amps will be required to drive them - very interesting type of motor, i can see a use for them in a different project :)
  5. Gadget999

    Gadget999 Active Member

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    a good video here

    do you think this motor would make a good direct drive steering wheel ?
  6. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    yes, a high current for short time, but as the current is "almost unlimited" if you use directly the 220v, that simplifies the electronic parts (no need of power supply)
  7. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    probably that can run ! in particular if you do not need a high reactivity
  8. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    Here after the control architecture I would like to try. Could you give me your opinion (I think that has never been tried...)
    universal motor diagram.jpg
  9. ferslash

    ferslash Active Member

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    i hope this work, :thumbs
    by now im "wasing" your thread :D:D:D:D (bad joke)
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  10. Gadget999

    Gadget999 Active Member

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    Does the arduino measure the current, how does it control the h bridge ?

    Easier to use the smc3 program to control the motor and use a potentiometer to measure location.

    Is there a h-bridge you have in mind ?
  11. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    hahaha thank you for your relevant comnent, that helps me a lot...:grin I do not understand your joke, is it a pun with washing machine ? (do not forget I am French, or Frog as you want:grin
    Next post I will show you a Hbridge board I am designing:nerd
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  12. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    yes arduino will check the current and adjust the pwm if necessary (can accept in rush current above the max, but for a short time). The speed will also be measure, but just for a better pid control.
    I have effectively a good idea of the h bridge I will use. Electronic circuit my next post...
  13. ferslash

    ferslash Active Member

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    @Oms :D yes, my comment was related to the washing machine motor and "watch" thread button in the forum to follow your conversation.

    now, in serious business i am usless in electronic stuff, but here in mexico getting nice motors is super expensive and a headage if you are succesfull i will run to buy a washing machine motor (there are lots of them at junk yards)... on the other hand, just in a teoric way, consider some path of development for 110v users, here in the american country electricity comes in 110 version :(

    please keep posting

    best wishes from mexico

    fer
  14. Oms

    Oms known as "Doc6dof"

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    Dear Fer,
    I see you have a great sense of humour... :grin:grin:grin
    No problem with 110V, I will design an electronic compatible from 110V to 240V. I am closed to have finished the electronic circuit diagram of the H bridge (I will use an old frequence/voltage variator I designed in the past to drive 3 phases asynchronous motor, where I am supressng 1 bridge and other electronic parts not usefull).
    In France also we can find used woshing-machine in Junk yards, bu also you can buy it for a small fund of money. Sometime you have just to change brushes, after that your motor is new. Generaly it is not the motor which breaks down (because very robust) but rather drum bearings, or electronic.

    Kind regards fromToulouse (South of France)
    Patrick
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