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New G-seat Build.

Discussion in 'Commercial Simulators and Peripherie' started by Andrew Lawrence, Dec 31, 2017.

  1. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    Hi guys,
    My name is Andrew, I am new here. I am working on a g-seat based on Spit40's design. I have been talking with him a lot, he has been very helpful with my questions and such. Thank you Spit40! :thumbs

    Anyway, I am a small business owner. If the g-seat works out I may try to market the kit or pre-built on a limited basis to fill in low spots of my regular business. I have a lot of work to go on it yet, perfect the design, work out the bugs, etc... Since there seems to be no kits out there, would anyone be interested in such a setup? Just trying to gauge the interest of such an endeavor.

    Andrew

    Attached Files:

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  2. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR - The Next Generation Staff Member Moderator SimTools 2.0 Beta Tester

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    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    Noorbeast, thank you for letting me know, and thank you to Pit for moving it to the proper location.

    Andrew
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  4. Spit40

    Spit40 VR Rift Flyer

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  5. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    Just a little more history and info on my project and plans for those that may be interested.

    This is not my first foray into doing a motion simulator. Years ago I had a seat, I think it was called a Joy Rider, that used pneumatics. Tried to re-do it, but never was happy with the results.

    I worked for a fortune 500 company for about 14 years. Most of that time was in their research and development facility. I worked for a group that took care of computers in labs and development areas, so have a lot of experience with connecting robotic systems and such to computers.

    About 5 years ago I left them to start my own business. I have a few unique niche electronic products that sell world wide, and am a leader in the field. I won't go too much into it here as I don't think it is too relevant.

    Long story short, VR flight simulators are one of the things I love to do. Taking that next step in realism was only logical. Looking to find a motion sim in the size range, and price range I was looking for, I did not come across anything. The idea of the G-seat intrigued me, but I was shocked to not find anyone that made these any more, or provide kits. This is much the situation that lead me into my other business.

    So here I am looking at doing a g-seat for myself, and then possibly expanding to off it to others.

    My business plan has always been to deliver a quality product, at a good price. So much of what I see out there is so over priced for what you get.

    Right now I am in the first prototype stage. As you can see from the pictures I am using wood. There is a good possibility that this will change to metal later. For right now, it is for ease of use to get things built quickly. I have already talked to people about plasma cutting and welding steel for the final product.

    I am still in the learning curve of things as well. All the concepts make sense to me, but I have no experience with SimTools or Arduino, so I am learning as I go. Thanks to all those that have been supportive and helpful in that.

    So, what is the ultimate goal for this project and possible product? To provide a quality, fully functioning g-seat, at a cost that will interest more sim enthusiasts. I will be doing these in my spare time from my other business, so I may be able to build 2-3 a month, and expand from there if needed. I am shooting for a goal of a selling price of under $1,000USD, but at the moment that looks hard to hit. It still may be possible however if I can cut some deals for components in quantities.

    Thanks!
    Andrew
  6. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    I figured I would get a little more interest in this, maybe a lot of people come and go saying the same thing. Anyway, an update on my progress with the protype seat.

    The first prototype is completed and working perfectly. I am working on tooling up for production. The prototype uses wood for the flaps and such. The final version will be all plasma cut and welded steel to make it stronger and more profesional. I have also integrated a 4 point harness with shoulder tensioners linked with the heave flaps. I have tested it with several racing games, and a couple of flight sims along with the Oculus Rift, and the results are amazing. I am looking at adding transducers for vibration effects now.

    If anyone is interested, I am looking for someone that knows at least some about these systems to do a look at and review of the seat. If someone is interested I can do the first production seat at a price just over cost for this purpose. If you are interested, contact me, and we can talk.

    Andrew
  7. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    Update on the prototype build. I now have all components converted to plasma cut and welded steel. No bolts and nuts, no wood. It is much stiffer now, and working perfectly well. Here is a video of the chair running with the wood flaps before conversion. I will get some pictures up of the steel conversion at some point.

    I would love to hear some feedback!



    Andrew
    • Like Like x 3
  8. Mats

    Mats New Member Gold Contributor

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    Hello Andrew!
    I am very interested in your project, today I have a Prosimu T1000. and want to expand with a G-Seat. Will it be possible to mount the chair with side bolts, such as a standard rally chair?
  9. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    I don't see why not. It is a standard racing seat made by ProCar. It has bolt holes on it for a set of rails. So with a set of rails in place, I would think it would bolt right up. I have been debating the legs, on how best to do them. I think a non permanent placement would be the best so that the seat can be mounted to another rig. If you don't need the legs, I can leave them off for sure, and adjust the price accordingly.

    Andrew
  10. runar totland

    runar totland New Member Gold Contributor

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    This one looks sweet. Do you have a final price and date when you will be able to start sell/ship? :)
  11. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    I am shooting for "built to order" beginning April 1st. I am working on a vibe system right now. I will put up some pictures later of where I am at. the seat will come as much PnP as I can do. I am working with Yobuddy on licensing, and locking down some settings just so the customer does not push the servos past a certain point and cause possible damage.

    It will come with the base/legs, 4 point harness with tensioner connected to the heave flaps, and the vibe system, with 2 amplifiers, 4 transducers, and SimTools 2.2. Still working on the vibe system, but let me say that it adds A LOT to the system. Feeling engine rumble, and road texture is awesome.

    I was trying to shoot for under $1000, but with the extra's, and all the time and equipment I have bought to produce them, that price is just not practical at this point. Looks like around $1200-$1300.

    Andrew
  12. michiw

    michiw New Member Gold Contributor

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    Hi Andrew,

    Any further developments on this? I am interested to see what you came up with for a final product (if it is there yet).
  13. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    Setbacks, setbacks, and work. LOL

    Work has had me busy lately, so I have not had as much time to work on it as I want, but when I do, I seem to cause myself setbacks. I am still working on it, and do plan to sell once it meets all my requirements, but things have been backed up by a few weeks at least, probably a month or more.

    First setback was overheating of one of the servos. The heave servos seemed to run cool and fine on everything I tested, LFS, other racing sims, flight sims, etc, except when I tried the F-18 on AFS2. I pushed it hard, high G turns which would leave the heave flaps in the up position for long periods of time. After a bit, I started to smell them heating. I want to make sure that no matter how much they are pushed, they will hold up. Pushed it till one burnt out. This was with heat sinks and fans on them for cooling.

    OK, back to start, for heave, I would have to use something else.

    I put two 380KG servos on in place of the 260s. With the higher push, I figured they would run cooler. The 380 is slightly slower at 0-60* in 0.5 seconds instead of the 0.24 seconds of the 260. Comparing them, it was indeed slower, but they seemed more sensitive in smaller movements. The feeling overall was not that much different from the 260s. If anything the higher strength gives a greater throw with my weight on it. I have pushed them HARD, and they stay cool, just above room temp, even with no heat sinks. One down side is they are quite a bit louder than the 260s. This is due to gearing, not much can be done about it. I re-packed them with grease, but not much of a difference in sound. I figure most people will be using a good headset anyway, that will cover most of it.

    Setback two. I have a shed converted to a work space for my work. I decided to move the computer and set out there, and out of the living room. Makes it easier to work on, plus it makes the wife happier that I have it out of the living room. LOL

    Brought it out, hooked it up and one of the heave servos started going bananas and then stopped. "What the heck?" Checking things over I found the 24v ground wire that goes to that servo had come loose, and grounded out to the frame. Hooked it back up, still no output from it. Trying to diagnose the problem, I moved the servo wire to another channel on the Arduino board which I new was working. It worked all right, but was reversed. It slammed the heave flap all the way up to where the push rod was pushing on part of the frame. Scrambling to power it down (I probably should put an Estop on it), I heard a "pop", and the motor spinning like crazy.

    Tore the servo down to find that it had actually broken one of the steel gears! It must have been pushing a heck of a lot of pressure.

    So, when it grounded out, it took out a channel on the Arduino. The other channels seem to work, but not knowing what else it may have done I opted for an new Arduino which came yesterday. A new 380 servo is on the way. In the meantime, I do have a good 260 that I can put on for temporary.

    On a good note, the GameVibe system works awesome. Even without GameVibe, direct audio to the transducers makes for some good vibration effects. AFS2 is great feeling the engine RPM or rumble of the jet. You can even feel the rumble of the runway when you touch down.

    So, still a work in progress. :)

    Andrew
  14. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    New video!
    • Winner Winner x 1
  15. Andrew Lawrence

    Andrew Lawrence Member Gold Contributor

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    picture 33.jpg

    After many hours of testing, I am now ready to build a few of these seats. I am confident in the performance it provides and how well it works. These are all built to order. For the first few at least, I will not be holding components on hand due to costs, so please allow about 6 weeks for me to gather all the components, assemble, and test the unit. We can discuss down payment, and final payment on completion, on a case by case basis.

    I am discounting the first 5 units. Full disclosure, I have $800+USD in components invested into the seat. I wanted to shoot for a price tag of $1000 or less, but with the time, and tools invested, that is not possible. Regular price will be $1299 as I need to cover the plasma cutter, welder, and other tools, as well as assembly time. However, I am pricing the first 5 units at $1099, plus actual shipping costs.

    The end product may vary slightly from the pictures as I implement a few things I have learned, to make the final product better.

    What you get:

    Pro Car Race Seat
    Seat stand
    Plasma cut and welded steel components
    Heave and Surge flap system picture 22.jpg
    4 point harness
    Harness tensioner, straps connected to heave flaps, will tighten as flaps move
    Vibration System, 2 amplifiers and 4 transducers, one on each flap.

    Please feel free to ask any questions, I am more than happy to answer anything I can.

    picture 1.jpg
  16. SeatTime

    SeatTime Well-Known Member SimTools 2.0 Beta Tester

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    Looks great . Hope everything goes well in your venture.
  17. Bilao

    Bilao New Member

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    I haven't my 2dof finished and now this made me think if i want this or the chair to move:think
  18. imagebuff

    imagebuff New Member Gold Contributor

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  19. Werner Schlager

    Werner Schlager New Member

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    Hi Andrew,

    I am currently running a d-box motion simulator system and would like to add your seat to it.
    So i am interested in buying it. Is the shipping to europe (Austria, near Vienna) expensive? What is the weight of the seat?
    Is it ready for using 240v? What is the peak power draw of the seat? My d-box gp-pro 200 runs of a converter to 110v, too. So no problem there, maybe i can even run both off one converter...

    Werner
  20. AussieSim

    AussieSim Member

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    There are a number of different sounds in the YouTube video above. In LFS there is the game audio, plus a metallic rattle. In the Aerofly demo there is game audio, plus RC servo noises (from about 5min), and a metallic tractor rattle (that gets louder at 5:30 when you lift the rear cover).

    Is the metallic rattle sound the bass shakers vibrating ?

    Can you make a video with game audio off and the bass shakers off ?