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Ego's SimForceGT - with DC actuators

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Projects' started by egoexpress, Sep 6, 2007.

  1. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Hi,

    Let's try it with firgelliauto actuators and Tronicgr' DIY motion controller 1.5 ...

    Edit:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtBf-dH-KS4

    DSC1543.jpg

    Related links:
    Tronicgr' DIY motion control interface 1.5 for motor actuators,
    Tronicgr' DIY h-bridge


    Regards
    Christian
  2. RaceRay

    RaceRay Administrator Staff Member SimAxe Beta Tester

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    My Motion Simulator:
    2DOF, DC motor, SimAxe, SimforceGT
    Hi Ego,

    that´s the first time i see your Sim, looks great!!! The Actuators looks very massive an stable, too. I am a little bit surprised, that they reach 75mm/s, thought they could only reach round about 40mm/s. You really should try to change the ratio of the transmission. The Actuators are build to move heavy weights and not to move very fast. So, i think > 150mm/s should be possible for a load of 10kg on every actuator without any problems, and with the build in motors.



    By the way, please tell me, what you paid for the profiles and from where do you got them.

    ( I hope, the dual driver arrives today, still not there, tho the trackingsystem told me, package was send 4 days ago :-( )
  3. tronicgr

    tronicgr

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    Hi Ego,

    Nice setup!

    It will be a little challenge to combine the x,y acceleration movements into cooperated motion of the motors though, but is can be done...

    Keep up the building...

    Regards, Thanos
  4. Mike78

    Mike78 New Member

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    looks good

    like a frex :p
  5. Roadster2

    Roadster2 Member

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    What is the model number of your actuators. Looking at the prices on the Firgelliauto.com web site they seem very reasonable compared with others I have looked at previously.

    Does this mean that we could really get a grip on this project ?
  6. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Hi Roadster

    Welcome!

    They are quite slow compared to the Frex ones. Dont know if I should recommend it to buy them right now.
    And they need reworking in order to be able to connect the rod-ends as well^^

    If you want to buy some though, then look at these ones for a Frex-style sim.
    http://www.firgelliauto.com/default.php?cPath=109

    Connecting them to 24V makes them run faster ;)

    ego
  7. Roadster2

    Roadster2 Member

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    Hi Ego

    Thanks for the link. If only the SCN5's were this price - problem solved !

    I assume that running the Firgelliauto units for any length of time at double the voltage would have a negative on the motors, these being designed to run at 12V. Even doubling the voltage will only increase the speed to 4 per second (no load) and I believe the SCN5 actuators are 400mm (15.75) per second. This does seem a massive difference. Obviously why the SCN5's are much more expensive.

    I will keep an eye on things here for a while longer I think. See how things develop.
  8. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    @Roadster

    Do you really think that I dont know the specs of the SCN5? They are a piece of art. Nearly a miracle!

    But just for an example Thom Theisson' Frex video.

    He set the speed to 10000 (whatever for a unit) though 16000 is possible. But ask him how long he can take 10000. Ok, its impressing for show purposes, but I dont think one can sustain this speed for more than 5mins.

    The firgelliautos, on the other hand, are crap and slow, but cheap. But they can be controlled by connecting them simply to a DC motor driver.
    Imho the 24V isnt a problem, as they wont drive with high speed under load permanently.

    Though they are much slower than the SCN5, I think they could be fast enough for a nice ride. Keep their price in mind.
    Here in Euorpe we have to pay shipping and customs on top!

    I have to test them under better conditions. After this test I'll report back.

    Besides that. I thinke that they are rated for 12V, because the end switches are too small to stop them at 24V. They just run over them ;)

    You'd had to build an interface which communicates with the controller of the SCN5.
  9. kjg71

    kjg71 New Member

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    linear motors

    Ego,

    Nice cockpit. I am surprised that those go 2 a sec. That is not to bad for flight turns in a smaller craft. If they could go 6 a sec per RaceRay that would be something.

    I am getting interest in these motors for linear needs if they will go that fast.

    For rumble effects, I think I would be happy with I-vibe seat

    These motors are very inexpense here in the US but the specs much slower then you stated I have always passed them up because of that.

    http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?U ... e=electric

    do yours run at this speed only with 24V?

    will that damage them? I am not an expert in motors so I assumed they had a gearing to them that limits speed but maybe not on these and they can in fact be pushed much harder?

    Regards Kyle
  10. EvanF

    EvanF Member

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    kjg71

    Last year I ran tests with my 24v 3000N 10mm/sec linear actuator. In one of the tests I used a Lab bench supply and gradually moved up the scale until I juiced it with 80 volts. It moved just over 3x faster, I timed it by placing a ruler beside the actuator 'ram' and stopwatching it. This is inline with the theory of doubling the voltage doubles the speed. At 40 volts the motor got warm slowly, but at 80 volts the motor got warm very quickly, I must have run 80v into it for about 2 complete extensions of 300mm (in and out) and it began to smell of warm oil, I wouldn't advise it but it showed the screw thread was up to faster movements.
    As ego has inferred in other postings, you have to be careful what nut you get with the linear actuator. ego knows which one is the best to look out for, I can't remember offhand. The one in mine is a nylon nut and I have had to machine (well a mate did) a brass 'bush' to stabilise the ram on maximum extension as at hi-speed this will get unstable.

    Anyway thats my experience with them so far if it's worth 2 cents to yah.

    @ego
    apologies if this went slightly off topic and perhaps belongs in actuator area!

    regards
    EvanF
  11. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    @Kyle

    Between slightly overvoltaged and driving an actuator with 3times more power is a difference.

    The actuator itself is rated at 2per sec and 100N @12V.
    Please watch at firgelliauto website for the different models.

    By setting the current to max of 24V doesnt mean, that the acutator gets permanently 24V. Just the peak voltage will be 24V.

    With 24V they drive a lot faster ;)

    The problem is imho the plastic nut.

    BTW: I opened a thread in the actuators section for the firgelliauto actuators...


    ego
  12. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Heres a short vid that shows the self-centering procedure of the frame with Thanos' interface 1.5 and 12V PSU.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoE5l-EenQo

    Stay tuned...more vids will follow soon.

    Regards
    Christian
  13. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Here's another vid!

    Thanos' AVR Controller 1.5 and actuators work fine together now :yippiee:
    (12V powered still)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STI_tkt8fnE

    Its running with LFS already right now :dance1: :dance3: :dance5: :dance2: :dance6:

    I'll make a more cinematic video with GTR2 and beamer at the weekend. Have to finetune the settings a little now.

    Stay tuned...

    Regards
    Christian
  14. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Its really amazing how well it works! Cannot wait to show you more vids :yippiee:

    Regards
    Christian
  15. yobuddy

    yobuddy Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator SimAxe Beta Tester SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Congrats ego, can’t wait for more vid’s!
    yobuddy
  16. tronicgr

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Yeah, It works amazingly well! Can't wait to see it in action with the faster-calibrated firmwares I've sent.

    :clap:

    Perhaps you could try with 24volts for faster extension speed... If I remember well you are powering it from two batteries placed parallel? Put them is series and try it. But watch the motor's temperature...

    Regards, Thanos
  17. Alle

    Alle Member

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Very Nice Ego...thr movements are very precise!

    Can't wait for new movie...

    Alle
  18. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    No, I haven't loaded the car batteries yet. Currently its powered by a 12V 2A Laptop PSU. (Just for the testing procedure).
    I know that it is too weak.
    I have a 5A fuse connected between the the h-bridge and PSU as well

    I'll flash the more direct firmwares you gave me now.

    Regards
    Christian
  19. EvanF

    EvanF Member

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Go on ego you can do it, give it some herbs. :thbup:


    Thanos
    @24V across the rails, would the 15V zeners need to be upgraded to handle the potential difference between gate and source of the FETs? :blush:
  20. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

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    Re: SimForceGT - with Firgelliauto actuators

    Hi Evan. You seem to be right, but please discuss this issue in the proper h-brigde thread :)

    Thanks
    Christian