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Showroom BlazinH's 3DOF with Pitch, Roll, and most importantly, Heave

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Projects' started by BlazinH, Mar 3, 2014.

  1. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Hi everyone! This simulator took over two years to design and perfect. It started as a flight simulator only. In the beginning, I only knew how to get flight data from FSX and Lock-on Flaming Cliffs. I didn’t know this site or others like it existed, or that you could even get telemetry from racing titles. But after getting my flight simulator up and running after a year or so, I stumbled onto this sites motion software as well as an outsim plugin (for LFS) that I could use with the programming language I was already using. I download both software. The documentation for the software that was offered here at the time lacked coherent documentation and I just didn’t get it. So I set it aside and worked on getting LFS to work with the outsim plugin I found. That changed everything for me. While flight simulations are great, I found that I enjoyed racing more. So with the motivation for more racing, I installed the software I download here and started figuring it out. Soon, the world was opened up to me. The problem though was that my rig was designed for flight. In order to get a real racing experience, I had to greatly increase the speed of my platform. I did what I could with my current design but found that I was constantly breaking one thing or the other due to the increased stresses placed on them from racing. So I had to go through a redesign that took about another year to get all the issues worked out. The simulator in the videos below is the result.

    I have many, many, hours invested in brainstorming, design, construction, destruction, reconstruction, etc. before coming up with a design that will hold up to the rigors of racing. But I believe that I have finally got it right. And in comparison to other racing simulators with similar specifications, my design can be accomplished at a highly reduced cost. Therefore, I am unable to provide many specifics of my simulator at this time. While my concept is for that of the DIY’er, if I were to publish specifics at this time, a company or individual could take what I have spent years developing, and run with it without paying due compensation to the inventor. Some people, I think, have a misconception of what a patent is for. It is not to keep an individual DIY’er from making the product for themselves, but from keeping them or others for profiting from it. I wouldn’t have any issues with individuals using my design to make a simulator for themselves!

    In fact, if there were the demand where I could take this to the next level, I would focus on the DIY’er. While many of the components used can be procured locally by the builder, a few are proprietary and cannot. Therefore, my idea would be to break everything down into individual packages. The builder could purchase only a starter package that would include the actuator motors, electronics, power supply, custom software that allows the user to adjust all perimeters of the simulator on the fly (or race in this case), and of course, blueprints, instructions, and access to my website to download additional resources. Then I would offer other packages for this and that. The builder could purchase the additional packages they want and/or procure the rest for themselves if they desire. I believe a basic starter package would run around $5000-$6000usd but that’s just a fraction of a d-box starter system (that has inferior racing motion) or a Force Dynamics 301. The total cost I estimate to be $10,000-$12,000 but it could be reduced by procuring some of your own parts. Let me make clear though that this is not for sale and this is not an offer to sell at this time.

    While I can’t share as much as I would like right now, here are a few specifications:
    Maximum potential motor output (all motors combined)……....…… 5000 watts (dc)
    Household power requirement (including peripherals)…115vac@50/60htz 20amps
    Footprint (minimum)…………………………………….....…8ft x 8ft dedicated space
    Maximum platform weight (including platform)……........………….500 lbs

    PS While the platform will still work for flight simulations, due to racing redesign, it doesn’t give smooth flowing motion at slower rates of roll and pitch anymore.


    Below are a few videos of the simulator in action. My computers screen appears to have a bad image for a couple of reasons. First, I had to turn the brightness and contrast way down in order to see it in the video. Second, the image is in Nvidia 3d vision so there is a double image on the screen also. However, with the 3d shutter glasses on, this monitor provides a perfect 3d image because it is a DLP monitor. DLP is the same technology they use in the movie theaters for 3d. Besides 3d vision I utilize trackir5 to look out of the right and left windows and a blower on the top of my monitor for wind effects. The trackir5 had to be disabled for the videos though. I put a light bulb behind my rig to illuminate the rig better for the videos but the heat emitted from the light bulb interfered with the inferred detector at times. And you may notice four ribbons hanging down from the top of the rig. Those are not there in normal operation but I added them temporally so you can see the effect of the blower. Also besides the pitch of the platform, the seat pitches as well. This not only adds to the overall pitch angle, but also has the added benefit of being a seat belt tensioning system as well.

    So I’m about to embark on a journey to visit a few fantastic venues and drive at some terrific racetracks! You’re welcome to come along for the ride if you’d like. I’m sorry but I don’t have room in the front seat for you. But I made a place behind where you can still come along and see the action. So jump in and come take a ride with me! I only wish I had some 3d glasses that would work for you too!

    Our first stop is rFactor at Bathurst. What an amazing track especially with heave and an AI driver at the wheel! Don't forget to set the highest video resolution you can stream effectively.


    Next we'll do some rally racing with Dirt3 in Michigan. I'm doing the driving from here on.


    Now we'll run Grid to do some street racing in San Francisco.


    That was a bumpy ride but a lot of fun. Next we'll switch gears to driving an F1 car at Melbourne.


    That was exhilarating! But its on to the last track at Donington Park with GTR2. GTR2 has some of the best road effects you will ever feel.


    I'm in the process of a new build at the moment. Since the simulator showcased here was originally made for flight, I felt that moving the monitor with the platform was a necessity. However, since I have switched primarily to racing, I decided to try a setup that doesn't. By doing this I can also try a triple screen arrangement now. I don't think after using a single 67" monitor that having a triple screen with small monitors would be that much of an improvement. The 67" monitor is about as large as you can get on the platform so divided by three would leave 23" monitors. But that's not my style. I like big! So since I already had three 61" DLP monitors, I decided to go the chair mover only route and use them. This will allow me around a 160"+ diagonal screen. They will wrap around 170 degrees of the drivers front view. I have found an issue though with trying to wrap such large screens (not a new issue though). Since the video is rendered flat, when you bend the side monitors in, the angle of the road changes between the monitors. It was worse trying to drive with them that way than without because it really throws off your judgement as to where the apex is. But I came up with a solution that works for me although others may not wish to solve the problem the same way I did. I ended up tilting the side monitors at an upwards diagonal to bring the lines of the road back parallel. This has the effect though of leaving an open triangular shape at the bottom between the monitors. But for me its far better than the alternative.

    The new build will incorporate heave also but at a slightly reduced amount than the first one due to the monitors not moving with it. But the trade off is without a monitor on the platform, and with a reduced movement, the motion will only be quicker. I'll post more about this build when possible.
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    Last edited: Mar 4, 2014
  2. mad_marty

    mad_marty Member

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    Nice work. I would love to see some more and better lit pictures of your simulator. 5000 watts sounds a lot for DC-Motors. I guess your controller is a self-programmed solution?
  3. bsft

    bsft

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    thats a wild ride for sure!
  4. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    BlazinH,
    Wow - that's for sure "tearing it up" friend.

    Tom
  5. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    @mad_marty Motion control is handled by software I wrote that runs on a PC. It directly controls up to three Sabertooth motor controllers. 5000 watts is a lot yes. But that is potential output across all motors. In reality, you wont be using all the potential power available at once. And I'll work on getting some more and better quality videos. Thanks for the interest!

    @bsft @cthiggin Thanks for the kind words my friends!
  6. vawriss

    vawriss New Member

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    (Seattime) Great work, the heave is epic. You must have some seriously sized actuators to get that much motion with so much mass.
  7. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    I updated all the videos in the top post to high definition. I had also planned on using a few more videos in the post but I was limited to a total of five. So I will post them here.

    Another great title with some of the best road effects is, and no surprise, GTR Evolution. We'll do it in an F3.



    And for you Nascar fans, Watkins Glen in Nascar Racing 2003 Season



    And I was also going to post a short video showing how the 3d glasses clears up the double image. But it's still not 3d because we are only looking thru one of the lenses.



    Also here is the triple screen setup I plan on using with my next build.
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2014
  8. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    That statement doesn't make since.

    The motion can be turned down if you can't handle it or don't like it that way. But the motion is good. Look at the videos again.

    I'm not commercial.
  9. bsft

    bsft

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    do you have any photos of the unit we can see?
  10. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, but not at this time for the reasons I have fully and openly disclosed above. But if you’re trying to say that makes me a commercial entity in your view then so be it. However, I don’t have a business name, a business bank account, a business license, a tax license, workers compensation insurance, liability insurance, a building, employees, office equipment, manufacturing equipment, etc. or even something to sell! So I don’t think I actually qualify for the title. However, if I ever do though, and commercial licenses are required if I decide to use SimTools with it, I will by all means comply with what is necessary!

    My intentions of this thread are to showcase the motion of my simulator and give some background on its development. That way, when I post something and/or give some advise to someone, they can see where my background comes from. If I posted incorrectly using showroom or under this topic, I don’t have any issues with it being moved to the proper location.
  11. bsft

    bsft

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    No you didnt post incorrectly, but lets examine some of your previous posts

    "
    I have many, many, hours invested in brainstorming, design, construction, destruction, reconstruction, etc. before coming up with a design that will hold up to the rigors of racing. But I believe that I have finally got it right. And in comparison to other racing simulators with similar specifications, my design can be accomplished at a highly reduced cost. Therefore, I am unable to provide many specifics of my simulator at this time. While my concept is for that of the DIY’er, if I were to publish specifics at this time, a company or individual could take what I have spent years developing, and run with it without paying due compensation to the inventor. Some people, I think, have a misconception of what a patent is for. It is not to keep an individual DIY’er from making the product for themselves, but from keeping them or others for profiting from it. I wouldn’t have any issues with individuals using my design to make a simulator for themselves!
    "
    I only asked for a few photos, most commercial companies need a LOT more than a few pics to copy something. You have contradicted yourself saying you help DIYers but withhold information and photos, that doesnt help anyone. I only asked for some photos

    "
    In fact, if there were the demand where I could take this to the next level, I would focus on the DIY’er. While many of the components used can be procured locally by the builder, a few are proprietary and cannot. Therefore, my idea would be to break everything down into individual packages. The builder could purchase only a starter package that would include the actuator motors, electronics, power supply, custom software that allows the user to adjust all perimeters of the simulator on the fly (or race in this case), and of course, blueprints, instructions, and access to my website to download additional resources. Then I would offer other packages for this and that. The builder could purchase the additional packages they want and/or procure the rest for themselves if they desire. I believe a basic starter package would run around $5000-$6000usd but that’s just a fraction of a d-box starter system (that has inferior racing motion) or a Force Dynamics 301. The total cost I estimate to be $10,000-$12,000 but it could be reduced by procuring some of your own parts. Let me make clear though that this is not for sale and this is not an offer to sell at this time."

    Parts can be made up, goodness knows I know that, people I have helped get started just make their own part. I am not planing to buy it, but thanks for the info.
    And what website do you speak of for download of additional resources?

    "
    Sorry that I haven’t posted any pictures or videos of my simulators or designs. The truth is that by posting them here I most likely would be forfeiting my right for patent protection in most countries should I chose to pursue any in the future. However, I can probably post a few videos of the motion only along with some of the specs. I’ll try to get something together. I would like to get some feedback from the community to see if there would be an interest.
    "

    I might have read that wrong but applying for patents is trying to stop potential others taking the design, and as far as I know , a change of 5-10 % of design and you cannot claim it. Most people would only spend money on patents if they had eventual commercial interests.


    "
    Hi @bsft . You have made an accusation so please provide any proof whatsoever that I am “obviously stealing and not sharing"! All I have done here is to share information in an attempt to help other members from what I have learned from my own experiences in building my own simulator before I even knew this or other sites like it existed. Just because I don’t care to share my designs on this site doesn’t mean I’m stealing from others. If I were “stealing” from this site I would have nothing to protect anyway because it is no longer patentable once in the public domain. Since it is now public domain it would not be stealing by definition either. It is offered for free for anyone to use. So if you’re concerned about people “stealing” from what you post, then maybe you should be the one that stops posting here!
    "

    if its offered for free, then post a few pics.
    If I was concerned about stealing of info, I would have stopped long ago. There are a few of us here that have been burnt by posting info and it has gone elsewhere, but thats part of life. Plagiarism happens and has been happening for ages. Thats either facts, info, parts, etc.

    "
    And please explain how if I stop posting that this is beneficial to the community! You can take or leave the information I provide so of what harm am I doing? So just because I may not share everything I know I shouldn’t post anything anymore? How will this help people? Do you feel threatened because I said I might have commercial interest in the future? None of this makes any since to me. My point of view, the more information the better regardless of where and whom it comes from!
    "

    I am not threatened by any possible commercial plans you have for the future, I only asked for some photos.
    There has been commercial guys come on here and we have shared info and everyone has been happy. If you want to keep it secret, then do so. But you may not like the responses you get from other members.

    Oh and in regards to your post above, "if you decide to use simtools" ? Huh? isnt simtools any good for you then?
    And I dont actually know where your background is from as I may have missed it.
    I am a picker packer in a warehouse that is good with building stuff.
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  12. eaorobbie

    eaorobbie Well-Known Member SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    mmm TM Engineering is a commercial company in America producing amusement rides and stuff, so is your video labeled incorrectly mmmmm
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2014
  13. AceOfSpies

    AceOfSpies Living the Dream!

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    Hi Guys,
    I thought that I would put in my 2 cents worth in this exchange. @BlazinH has posted a few videos of a simulator that is very impressive in the motion it achieves. He doesn't wish to give any detail of the construction. Well, that's OK. Like everyone else on the Forum, he's not obliged to reveal any of his "secrets". It may not be wholly in keeping with the spirit of the great community that we have here, but its not a big deal. He has freely offered advice to people in the past and that is in the spirit of the Forum.
    Maybe its time to take a pause and think about what is important to the community. No need for anyone to fall out!

    Mike
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  14. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    @bsft I would like to respond to your “examination” but it would take away to much from my building time so no comment!

    @eaorobbie Thanks Robbie! That’s really a compliment comparing my simulator with something a company with real resources could do! But no, that appears to be an audio/video company. I’m not infringing on their name because, if I had a simulator business, it would be in a different industry! I had to get an account to post videos here and it is my engineering. I used TM for my own reasons. However, I think I may change it as I still can. Thanks for “investigating” me so you could tell me that!

    @AceOfSpies Thank you! And I agree that there is no reason anyone should ever feel like falling out when they are trying to help members because some other members here don’t want what everyone has to offer when it doesn’t conform to their liking. That is definitely not in the spirit of a community!
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2014
  15. bsft

    bsft

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    @BlazinH http://bffsimulation.com/linear-act.php i bought the plans and I am building a shorter throw version with @eaorobbie help. Not a hidden agenda, just time frame to actually build the things. The actuators I am building would not lift a whole frame, they are not designed for that. I am not after photos to copy anything
    I can start a thread if you like and post photos as I go, but the time frame for building will be over several weeks.

    If you want to start talking about copying , then call dbox and tell them I copied this frame
    mod sim.jpg
    and I built my frame like this
    403452763_IMG_20120414_114631_122_338lo.jpg

    or maybe you should phone up atomic joyrider and get them to question me because I maybe copied this frame
    atomic_front_side_profile_small.png
    and I built a frame like this
    actuator sim 1.jpg



    and thats Mr hypocrite to you......
  16. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    I appreciate the time you took to make a fair reply @bsft ; in this post anyway and except for the last line lol. Anyway, this gives me a chance to explain a little about patents. Probably unintentionally to you, you made my point for me! Before dbox or anyone else “publishes” any of their material, if they intend to patent it, they must apply for a patent first and get what we call here in the United States anyway, patent pending status. They are then free to publish it because, after that point, if some other entity decides to “sell” it, once they get full patent status, the company has remedy’s it can take! If you read my original post again, I stated that I would have no problems with, “an individual making this for themselves”. Dbox doesn’t care and neither do I. There is no trade of money going on. What I didn’t state, and the difference is, I haven’t applied for patents yet, if I ever will! And I don’t know for sure exactly what would be all right for me to show you without nullifying a possible patent. Here is the dilemma. As you said earlier in a round about way, there is no reason to get patents unless there is a profit stream to protect. This is exactly true unless you just want to pay money for a patent for the sake of saying you have one! A patent not only costs a lot of money initially, but it cost further maintenance fees that get increasingly larger over time. To protect something with a patent for the fullest possible period of time, which is 17 years, it will cost over $20,000. That’s just in the United States. And that’s if one patent will cover everything; sometimes they may make you split it up and double the fees. It would probably cost over $100,000 to get patents in all the countries where a simulator company would wish to protect a profit stream. So the problem is, I can’t publish plans and instructions for members to build my simulator yet because I don’t have patents. And since patents cost a lot of money, I won’t get them unless I determine there is a demand enough for the product for me to do so. I can decide to publish them anyway at some point if and when I determine that it is not worthwhile to pursue patents any further, or after I get pending status. But that day hasn’t come yet. Sorry that I can’t.

    Thanks for clearing up somewhat the DIY linear actuator confusion. One of you said for sale only, the other said for DIY. Some members may like to know if the actuator you are making for the community is the same as the one eaorobbie said he would sell only? If not, does the DIY model have reduced performance? Honestly, I don’t care one way or the other myself, but at least I have tried to be upfront in my position. I would be doing the same thing eaorobbie is by selling a pre-made actuator but also the other necessary electrical hardware for DIY people to finish up their build on their own. I can’t see how this would make me any different than what he would be doing it sounds like! I hope he doesn’t forget to purchase his SimTools commercial license!

    p.s. I apologize for calling @bsft a hypocrite! And don’t worry, I saw your other post before it was pulled so it reached your intended target! That’s okay though. I really would like to burry the hatchet and try to be friends. Life is to short and precious to be making enemies!
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  17. bsft

    bsft

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    I posted the thread about DIY actuators for others the build, if they would like me to SELL them a set to them personally, I can. Thats as far as "sales" go with me.
  18. eaorobbie

    eaorobbie Well-Known Member SimTools Developer Gold Contributor

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    Ah that's my special and is a 2 year project, this is the first time that it has been mentioned here on site, yes built in secret and has commercial potential if the person that funded it ever turns back up, its not mine, I built it for him not for, sorry for the miss understanding in both cases, I get a little sceptical after being burnt by another commercial company, nearly cost me 1000's in court but was proven it was my design, first. I admit I jumped the gun , Badly.
    Dont mean to pick mate but once a name has a registered trademark you can get in trouble using it. Sorry to confuse you with them, You both are in the same State.
  19. BlazinH

    BlazinH Well-Known Member

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    Hi @eaorobbie , I jumped the gun myself! And I would be curious and do some searching also. So I made a deal out of nothing! Sorry about everything! I’m ready to let bygones be bygones and more forward in building this community we have and working to make it even better!

    My simulator was already operational for a long time before I became a member here. But I didn’t post anything about it because I knew members would want to ask questions (which is only natural) that I didn’t want to reveal answers too. It was easier not too! But after giving my opinions trying to help people along, I could hear some of you silently saying, “who does this guy think he is and what makes him think he has knowledge on the subject to give good advice” (which is natural too). That is why I finally posted something on my simulator so members would have some confidence that my advice is coming from some experience and I’m just not just full of bull! That’s not to say my advice will always be good (even though I will try), or that there won’t be a better way of course, but I have at least been around the block. In the future we will have more differing opinions, but a debate on ideas is a good thing I think. We just need to keep in mind that we are all on the same “team” and not let things get personal (in a bad way) if at all possible.
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  20. cthiggin

    cthiggin Active Member

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    Guys,
    I'm go glad everything has about worked out - all of you guys have too much too contribute than to fuss about stuff.
    Like I said a couple days ago, 90% Takers / 10% Givers - AND as a Giver, I've been burnt several times - told them "You Got Me Once" - But Not Again!" - I consider it their loss, not mine - but it does make us givers very gun-shy..............

    Please guys, let's just move forward and continue to make all kinds of good things happen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Have a blessed one my friends!

    Tom