1. Do not share user accounts! Any account that is shared by another person will be blocked and closed. This means: we will close not only the account that is shared, but also the main account of the user who uses another person's account. We have the ability to detect account sharing, so please do not try to cheat the system. This action will take place on 04/18/2023. Read all forum rules.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. For downloading SimTools plugins you need a Download Package. Get it with virtual coins that you receive for forum activity or Buy Download Package - We have a zero Spam tolerance so read our forum rules first.

    Buy Now a Download Plan!
  3. Do not try to cheat our system and do not post an unnecessary amount of useless posts only to earn credits here. We have a zero spam tolerance policy and this will cause a ban of your user account. Otherwise we wish you a pleasant stay here! Read the forum rules
  4. We have a few rules which you need to read and accept before posting anything here! Following these rules will keep the forum clean and your stay pleasant. Do not follow these rules can lead to permanent exclusion from this website: Read the forum rules.
    Are you a company? Read our company rules

X-Sim and speed related blower fans

Discussion in 'DIY peripherals' started by SimonME46, Jan 19, 2009.

  1. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Apologies if this has been asked before, I have tried searching..

    I have a couple of bilge blowers which are able to blow air in my face to give an enhanced sensation of speed, one of my friends who is literate about electronics (I am not) is helping me to get this up and running.

    My questions
    1. does X-Sim have a 'speed' out put which could be used to govern the speed of the fans?
    2. and is it possible to have X-Sim and Frex listening to the game at the same time?
    3. If I was to convert away from Frex, would I just need to d/l the software and buy 2 x USB - RS485 converters, and pretty much go play the games that Frex doesn't support

    If these Q's are covered elsewhere, please just point me at the threads...

    Cheers
  2. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,839
    Location:
    Germany - Frankfurt/M
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +7 / 1 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    @Simon

    Welcome!

    1. X-Sim is able to output dynamic values to external hardware interfaces/controllers.
    But with these signals you wont be able to drive a motor directly. You will have to amplify the PC signal with a motor driver like a h-bridge for example.
    So you will need the following:
    -hardware controller interface (Velleman k8055 for example or others)
    -driver (amplifier) like an h-bridge or other motor drivers.
    You probably should ask Thanos for further advice.

    2. Imho you should use both, the SCN5 and the fans, with X-Sim only. That would make the issue with making X-Sim work besides the Frex driver obsolete.

    3. I wouldn't say each and every game, but a bunch more. And at least no driver update is needed with every game update in most cases :brows:
    And yes, you would need just 2 cheap converters and the software, as you have the power supply already. BvillersJr has gathered some experience with SCN5, and would help you for sure with the connection.

    Btw, in case you would like to drive a rally race with a co-driver, you could easily change your SCN5 axis numbers to equal values, so that both SCN5 rigs would respond to a single output (that means both rigs would move in sync).
    EDIT: Oh, I see you are using 2 computers. In that case you could send the game data via the Force-Sender to the second computer as well. No need to change axis assignments at all.

    Regards
    Christian
  3. bvillersjr

    bvillersjr Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,174
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    Balance:
    437Coins
    Ratings:
    +22 / 1 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    I think his second computer may be because he has 2 Frex's installed. If that is the case, then he has one PC per Frex.

    A couple of other people have converted their Frex systems to X-Sim with good results. However, it is not a plug and play type of swap. For example, you will need to remove the plugs on your actuators and wire them to the RS485 adapters and power supply that you purchase.

    Additionally, X-Sim is not as easty to use as the Frex system (not yet anyway, but I'm working on a solution to that) but it is alot more powerful! If you are up to the task, then egoexpress is correct, an all X-Sim solution would be the best way to go, and I can help you through the process.
  4. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,839
    Location:
    Germany - Frankfurt/M
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +7 / 1 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    That is right. I was aware of that. He simply has to install the X-Sim software on both computers. Then he has to start the game on a single computer and establish a cluster network in the Force-Sender (by adding the IP numbers of both computers in the Force-Sender), which delivers the game data to the second computer as well.
    So the game data of one computer is delivered to both computers respective both SCN5 rigs ;D
  5. bvillersjr

    bvillersjr Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,174
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    Balance:
    437Coins
    Ratings:
    +22 / 1 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    I see. I assumed that they were entirely independent so that two people could race against each other.
  6. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,839
    Location:
    Germany - Frankfurt/M
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +7 / 1 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    That is right as well. I just suggested that it could be set up optionally to have both rigs moving simulatneously as well. That way a co-driver could take place on the second seat.
  7. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    Thanks for all the responses! - most helpful, and from the people who know what they are talking about.

    Just to confirm, yes there are 2 PC's, one for each Frex rig, and normally we race against each other, they are on the same LAN.

    I'm very interested in going over to an all X-Sim solution. In terms of the fans, one of my geeks is putting together a motor controller using a microprocessor, he plans on having it run on the X-Sim bus (using a jaycar 10AMp kit as a starting point).

    If I can match the connectors, I'd probably tend to make my USB - RS-485 connect to the existing SCN5 plugs rather than cut the plugs on the SCN5s. Wouldn't the current power supply connection stay in place?

    @ bvillersjr - Garth (my geek) asked if you are running an RS-485 bus - as there seemed to be one adapter per SCN5? Garth is going to read the documentation which will probably answer the Q's he has.

    Sounds like at the end of this process I should provide a Frex - X-Sim conversion thread so that gumbies like me who are only good for plug'n'play can have a step by step guide?
  8. bvillersjr

    bvillersjr Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,174
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    Balance:
    437Coins
    Ratings:
    +22 / 1 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    I can't comment on the interfacing of the Jaycar product to X-Sim, but if it has a serial interface, then it is likely that it can be made to work with X-Sim. Several others have more experience than I in this area, but it seems that they prefer Velleman or Pololu interfaces.

    Actually, yes, you should be able to use your existing power supply if you stay with the Frex cables and purchase opposite gender plugs to connect to RS-485 adapters. In your sim design, it seems that the cables may not be visible. In other designs, they are an eye-sore. I replaced them all together with a single-wire solution that connects to the circuit inside of the white plastic cap on the SCN5's.

    I use two USB<-->RS485 adapters. A complete part list for my build can be found here: http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/post10861.html#p10861

    Please, do. It's this essential exchange of knowledge that keeps this community alive.
  9. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,839
    Location:
    Germany - Frankfurt/M
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +7 / 1 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    <a class=postlink-local href=http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/post12751.html#p12751 target=_blank>post12751.html#p12751</a>
  10. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    Thanks for the link on the speedo/servo controls, and for the links to the pololu boards etc. I checked out bvillersjr thread and noted the 2 x USB=>RS485 - we were going to buy the same units but postage costs were a killer, we've ordered some local units.

    The fans that I am using are Rule Bilge Blowers 12V 4.3A, however startup current was 8.6A. I'm using these because I have some 75mm ducting off a real race car, and normal household fans don't push enough air to make a difference/can be 240V which I'd prefer to stay away from. The 100mm blower pushes 235cfm, which at 100mm duct should push air in my face at about 55km/h. By stepping down to 75mm, I should get close to 90km/h, which actually might be too much! [​IMG]

    This is all looking positive!
  11. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Re: X-Sim and Frex

    Your suggestion is an excellent plug and play option, I like it.

    Given Garth's input, we'll end up with a significantly cheaper kit built option, which we'll post up for others to consider.

    Cheers,
  12. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Good news - Garth has the boards together and has been controlling the fans in a test environment. Game plan at this stage is to plug them in on Friday and give them a trial run, see how his programing responds to the game outputs. I will then start carving up the mini to fit them in (should only be 2 x 75mm dia holes for the ducting, and a couple of rivet/wiring holes in the front guards).
  13. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    I have one of the fans installed and working, need some time to install the fan on the other side of the car. X-sim was amazingly easy to work with. We have one small 'unintended feature' which is a bit of a blip in the speed at low speeds, seems to iron out as it gets going faster.

    This really adds another dimension, really give a sensation of speed/slowing down, even though I've never had such ventilation in real life (I'd be interested to hear if real life race drivers could comment on ducting). I'm not sure how to share this, but I suspect that a video will give the wind noise idea!
  14. Mambo

    Mambo New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Messages:
    168
    Location:
    Czech Republic
    Balance:
    288Coins
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0
    Try to instal fringes infront of outlet. Then we can see how mutch is air blowing.
  15. mrpio

    mrpio New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2009
    Messages:
    27
    Balance:
    0Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Bump. Any news? Photos? Please?
  16. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Both sides installed in the mini, works really well and gives a great impression of speed. Actually gets a bit cold on the face, although it does adress a stuffiness problem in the car. They also pick up the smoke from the smoke machine (installed under the bonnet) and blow it into the car! Pls excuse the driving - one handed was harder than I thought...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7EvtJy2UBg
  17. RaceRay

    RaceRay Administrator Staff Member SimAxe Beta Tester

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2006
    Messages:
    4,656
    Occupation:
    Self-employed | Web and application development
    Location:
    Hamburg, Germany
    Balance:
    23,837Coins
    Ratings:
    +1,958 / 13 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    2DOF, DC motor, SimAxe, SimforceGT
    Are u kidding? You driving looks nearly perfect when you touch the curbs in left right turns :clap:

    What´s the reason for smoke generating under the bonnet except simulating water cooling problems :) ?

    br
    René
  18. egoexpress

    egoexpress Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,839
    Location:
    Germany - Frankfurt/M
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +7 / 1 / -0
    Good job!

    Could you tell us more details about the hardware you are using, and how you hooked it up to XSim?

    Some pics would be appreciated.

    Regards
    Christian
  19. SimonME46

    SimonME46 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT, Australia
    Balance:
    421Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Hehe - there were a few doors left wide open, esp on right handers.

    Engine on fire after smashing into the wall? - I use it as a trick when we have parties and people give the sims a go and crash into the wall. When ppl don't know ot's there, they poop themselves and think there is some sort of an electrical fire....
  20. mrpio

    mrpio New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2009
    Messages:
    27
    Balance:
    0Coins
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Great news! Can we expect to get some more technical info about this long-awaited innovation? Thanks in advance!