1. Do not share user accounts! Any account that is shared by another person will be blocked and closed. This means: we will close not only the account that is shared, but also the main account of the user who uses another person's account. We have the ability to detect account sharing, so please do not try to cheat the system. This action will take place on 04/18/2023. Read all forum rules.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. For downloading SimTools plugins you need a Download Package. Get it with virtual coins that you receive for forum activity or Buy Download Package - We have a zero Spam tolerance so read our forum rules first.

    Buy Now a Download Plan!
  3. Do not try to cheat our system and do not post an unnecessary amount of useless posts only to earn credits here. We have a zero spam tolerance policy and this will cause a ban of your user account. Otherwise we wish you a pleasant stay here! Read the forum rules
  4. We have a few rules which you need to read and accept before posting anything here! Following these rules will keep the forum clean and your stay pleasant. Do not follow these rules can lead to permanent exclusion from this website: Read the forum rules.
    Are you a company? Read our company rules

SCN6 alike actuators?

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Building Q&A / FAQ' started by Michael Hensen, Dec 4, 2017.

  1. Limongi

    Limongi Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2017
    Messages:
    66
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    Balance:
    - 7Coins
    Ratings:
    +57 / 0 / -0
    [​IMG]

    Micheal, I've been brainstorming about how to fabricate the small 350mm actuators and put down this rough idea in sketchup last night using 8080 extrusion. The ball screw fits on a bias if you cut a small notch in the two wider sides of the flange which would very easy to do. If the magnipot strips that @kermitkong discovered work well, they would be a perfect fit in this compact profile.

    I was also thinking one could cast the centre section of the extrusion with a solid plug of urethane and use the natural shrinkage to make a rounded bottom push rod from it. I'll draw up that idea as I'm not sure it makes sense from my description.

    Attached Files:

    • Like Like x 2
    • Creative Creative x 2
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2017
  2. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform
    WoW.. that looks really cool. Good find of the 8080!! I haven’t really thought about the design.. more on the driving part:) I don’t have anything to do with pots.. that is my advantage, will do 2 limit switches. Only 1 needed for calculating the center..

    My first step will be to write some code to generate the pulses for the servodrivers. For now I can use small stepper motors as the principle is exactly the same.. only the amount off steps per rotation is a lot higher..

    Keep me posted on your designs.. love to see your designs and borrow some :)

    Edit: Need to get all my parts sorted out, then I will have all dimensions. But I think I will keep an open structure so I can make a sliding rail fo more stability and keep t from twisting
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2017
  3. Bernd Manger

    Bernd Manger Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2015
    Messages:
    156
    Occupation:
    Measurement and control mechanic
    Location:
    Germany
    Balance:
    1,049Coins
    Ratings:
    +263 / 12 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    2DOF, DC motor, Arduino
    @Limongi, good idea with the 8080.
    If you mount an optical encoder on one of the belt-pulleys you don't need a MagnetoPot. Then the exact position is always known.
    If there is a closed loop stepper motor used, even that is not needed, it has the encoder already on board.
    For safety there are only two limit switches needed, one of them can also be used for finding the zero-point at start-up.
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  4. Limongi

    Limongi Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2017
    Messages:
    66
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    Balance:
    - 7Coins
    Ratings:
    +57 / 0 / -0
    Thanks Bernd, one of the issues that I found is that this design leaves little surplus for room and my second idea that I'm drawing up would basically eliminate it. Right now if you wanted to have a belt tucked inside you'd only be able to fit half of it inside with the other half running down the outside. So the magnetopot's extremely low profile (or another beltless solution) could be the keystone of this idea working or not.
  5. Limongi

    Limongi Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2017
    Messages:
    66
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    Balance:
    - 7Coins
    Ratings:
    +57 / 0 / -0
    Actually scrap the above comment about not being able to fit the belt, now going back and looking at it you could, in a similar fashion to 3-D printers run the belt down the inside of one of the outer slots.
  6. Bernd Manger

    Bernd Manger Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2015
    Messages:
    156
    Occupation:
    Measurement and control mechanic
    Location:
    Germany
    Balance:
    1,049Coins
    Ratings:
    +263 / 12 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    2DOF, DC motor, Arduino
    I think you misunderstood me. I meant to to place the quadrature encoder on the pulley which is on top of the actuator (the belt from the motor to the ballscrew), not inside the profile. The encoder counts the revolutions of the ballscrew.

    But there is another problem: The ballnut does not fit into the 8080 profile:
    8080 + 1610.png

    EDIT: I've just seen that there is a 100100 profile available.
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2017
  7. Limongi

    Limongi Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2017
    Messages:
    66
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    Balance:
    - 7Coins
    Ratings:
    +57 / 0 / -0
    Hi Bernd, thank you cor clarifying, I did misunderstand but it's clear now. I was hoping if aligned on the bias and the wide part of the flange notched/ milled it would fit perfectly in the 8080


    [​IMG]

    Attached Files:

    • 16.jpg
      16.jpg
      File size:
      90.5 KB
      Views:
      1,555
  8. Limongi

    Limongi Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2017
    Messages:
    66
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    Balance:
    - 7Coins
    Ratings:
    +57 / 0 / -0
    The 100100 is also most likely the path of least resistance and not much compromise to the compact design.

    Edit: not that it's much cost in the grand scheme of things sim related but interestingly the 100100 is double the cost of 8080!
    • Informative Informative x 3
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2017
  9. Limongi

    Limongi Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2017
    Messages:
    66
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    Balance:
    - 7Coins
    Ratings:
    +57 / 0 / -0
    Intention was not to make something so phalic in design, but it happens! This is the aforementioned idea using a telescoping cast or 3d printed centre section with a rounded bottom (like some dbox designs).

    Not shown here would be a cnc cut 15mm delrin end cap to act as the linear bearing, and assuming it would all have to be greased to deal with friction. Not sure if there is much benefit to this idea as it feels like it would have the greatest mechanical loss.
    [​IMG]

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Dec 17, 2017
  10. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform
    I would ad a PTFE liner inside then.. give it more slide and protect it from excessive wear..
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform
    I was thinking of small swivel feet but this looks cool too..
  12. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform
    This would be an idea of what I am after.. but at al lower pricepoint.. this set complete would be around $20.000
    I am aiming at 5500/6000 Euro complete.. so Actuators+ rSeat F1 + PC + Oculus..



    All I would like to do is have the actuator upside down.. So the weight of the motors isn't part at the weight to lift.. Just to compensate some of the extra weight of the rSeat F1 (65kg) in comparison with the playseat (20kg).. Although the weight difference tells something about the quality I guess :)
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2017
  13. Bernd Manger

    Bernd Manger Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2015
    Messages:
    156
    Occupation:
    Measurement and control mechanic
    Location:
    Germany
    Balance:
    1,049Coins
    Ratings:
    +263 / 12 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    2DOF, DC motor, Arduino
    What about going more to this direction:
    Linearantrieb.jpg

    This linear bearing systems have practically no friction and the dimensions are not larger than a 100100 profile.(I guess that's a nema 23 with 57x57mm)
    Ok, it's no optical highlight, but i would not care if i had a working actuator.
    There is always room for improvements and a housing.
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform
    All my options are on the table..
    My first priority is get a sample setup running with Arduino..

    But in this particular case I would reverse the ball bearing.. (need to print an adapter for it :) otherwise you've got a hand full off balls .. hmm sounds weird..)
    • Funny Funny x 1
  15. adgun

    adgun Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2008
    Messages:
    495
    Occupation:
    mechanic
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Balance:
    5,540Coins
    Ratings:
    +131 / 3 / -0
    Hi Michael
    If you want that youre actuators last, you need to build riggid ones.
    When youre sim tilts the actuators get a little side loaded this is very bad for a actuator.
    Frex sells now reinforced hyper axis because of this.
    Bernds idea with a linearslide is great ,mount a pushrod on it and those forces come on the linearslide
    regards Ad
    sorry for the bad english
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform
    I think I will follow Bernd's idea.. Thanks for that, makes me think again..
    Would make the linearslide with 20mm, and the weight need to be close to the rail ..
    I guess I need to buy me a cheap CNC machine first to make custom parts in aluminum.. The parts in china are cheap bit the shipping is killing sometimes..
    And European price are really business prices as the market isn't that big for parts..

    With the motor at the bottom you could extend the rails so that the motor is not sitting on the ground. and would give you probably the right amount of clearance.. Will see .. probably will have the motor on top if it won't obstruct the motion.. the weight of the motor is no issue with a slider..

    Again thank you guys for all your great comments and idea's.. This is gonna be a real beast.. Now hope we have no liftoff when hitting a bump :)
    Slowly collecting parts in my basket before I have all the parts and dimensions before I will start to draw something up..

    This thing is keeping me busy .. Holiday in a weeks time and then I stay in Spain for a couple of months.. But I'll start planning and building.. Will see how to get the beast back home if I ever would leave Spain.. :) and keeping the CNC thingy in the back of my head.
    • Like Like x 2
  17. adgun

    adgun Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2008
    Messages:
    495
    Occupation:
    mechanic
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Balance:
    5,540Coins
    Ratings:
    +131 / 3 / -0
    You can do almost evry thin with youre 3D printer
  18. misoswan

    misoswan Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2014
    Messages:
    286
    Balance:
    1,000Coins
    Ratings:
    +72 / 1 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, Arduino, JRK

    hi
    @Michael Hensen you know to recommend some cnc machine
  19. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform
    Some can and the prototype will have 3d printed parts.. but if it matures I think the forces are to big even for PETG.. But I sure will use the 3d printer first, as that is a thing I know how to use :)
  20. Michael Hensen

    Michael Hensen Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    166
    Occupation:
    C# Software Engineer
    Location:
    Almere, Netherlands
    Balance:
    748Coins
    Ratings:
    +186 / 0 / -0
    My Motion Simulator:
    3DOF, AC motor, Arduino, Motion platform

    Too bad no.. but what I would do is like with 3d Printers.. buy a cheap one and make your own upgrades as you go along..
    If it would be my choice it would be something like this one .. but also this is quite new to me.. not sure how many watts you need to comfortably cut aluminum