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Showroom Andrew's Full frame mover 2DOF - now with action vids and backlash issues

Discussion in 'DIY Motion Simulator Projects' started by delcarlo, Mar 31, 2017.

  1. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    Good evening all!

    This thread will start slowly as I currently have acquired none of what I need other than a wealth of information found here.
    <edit: scratch that.. all parts orders, sim frame under construction>

    Quick background. I love racing cars, and playing computer games. Recently my brother bought a cheap fixed sim frame for his playstation which lives at our office (we work together) and I thoroughly enjoy playing racing games on it.. I made a plan to build one as I enjoy fabrication and dislike paying for stuff I can make myself.

    F1 weekend at the 2017 Melbourne GP there were some simulators using basic 2dof platforms that a similar rig to my brothers sat atop. Driving the racing sim was incredibly fun and brought a whole new dimension that the fixed sim was missing. Inquiring on pricing it seemed ridiculous for what it was and that money is best spent on my real race car. I'm deep into DIY CNC, 3d printing and DIY quad copters, all utilizing arduino and thought surely guys out there are DIYing these things by now and that is how I came across this glorious forum.

    Its really nice to see a forum that is so active. Car forums have all died since the introduction of facebook and have lost that true archiving searchability that makes a forum so useful as a community

    Ok into the nitty gritty.
    CKAS (2).JPG
    This is the basis of the sim I want to replicate. Done differently, with the base and motors articulating the frame directly (ie no table in between) I want the whole lot to move including a light weight LED LCD TV.. I've been reading all the pros and cons about seat movers, frame movers etc. At the end of the day I have a real race car, and the whole thing moving will basically impress my friends more than trying to replicate or at least fool my brain into force felt for true immersion.

    I haven't done any actual work at work since finding this forum, it can really suck some hours out of your day!
    I am slowly nutting down specifics as far as components, electronics, motors and design. Miniature prototype is not my thing so i'll head straight into it.

    Thoughts on current specs would be appreciated
    Controller: Arduino Uno or Mega
    Drivers: Genuine MotoMonsters x 2 in half brige configuration
    or Sabretooth 2x32
    Motors: Motion Dynamics Industrial 200W 3200rpm 50:1

    not sure which way to go with the drivers as MM seem to have more support at the moment.
    priced similarly when not getting the china copy MM people seem to be having manufacturing issues with

    oh and feel free to talk me out of moving TV as it doesnt seem to be very common place around here
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    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  2. bodgy

    bodgy Member

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    Welcome mate. As far as drivers the pololu JRKs are really easy to setup and will work with your chosen motors no worries. I have no experience with the other options.

    Personally I think a static screen is the go, especially with the motors not being the most powerful things around. When you are driving a real car the horizon doesn't move with your car, does it?

    I feel your comment regarding facebook, hate that everything is based there now especially online classifieds. If people would just use gumtree I wouldn't need to search 10 different groups to find an item!

    Side note - Disproportionate number of Aussies on this site or what?
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    Last edited: Mar 31, 2017
  3. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    Yeah seems to be quite a few from down under. which is awesome as it makes tracking down parts easier

    I was under the impression the Jrk was 2x12A continuous where these motors are 27A continuous (which doesnt correlate to the 200W rating mind you)
    I have seen a few people using them with the Jrk but figured they must be throttling them back in the settings or not utilizing their full torque capacity.. as DC motors use most current when accelerating agaianst a full load, not free travel
    I'd like to try longer travel (7-8 degrees in both yaw and pitch) which is more than the few I've seen using this combination
  4. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    Also with the horizon changing, no it doesn't, and my head and body doesnt really move in relation to the windscreen either.. so that's why i figure the screen moving with my body and head would trick my body into feeling the forces and not the movement as much
  5. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    Everyone jumps in on the action down under :grin

    [​IMG]
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  6. bodgy

    bodgy Member

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    [​IMG]
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  7. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    Ok, pretty much finalised the design. I made a 3d model mainly to make sure things dont clash when moving and i'm bored waiting for my parts to arrive. model moves with Sketchup 2017 and MSPhysics plugin

    I had an idea of the frame using 32NB extra light pipe and wanted to make sure it would look good, sleek commercial looking sim is the aim.
    I will be making a start on the frame tomorrow.. uni joint will be centred on the COG with everything mounted so final location of that hasnt been set but it should be in the ballpark. dimensions for the motor location and length of arms based on getting 8 degrees of motion on each axis (up and down, total of 16)

    what do you think so far?

    parts ordered so far: Motion Dynamics 12V 200W worm drive motor 3200rpm 50:1 gearbox
    2 x motomonster in half bridge mode
    2 180 degree hall effect pots
    Arduino Uno

    (already have old bride style race seat and Logitech G27 wheel)

    concept drawing.jpg
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  8. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    I made a start on the frame yesterday, bit miffed (annoyed) the extra light NB pipe kinks in the tube bender. I normally bend 2.5mm wall at this radius, it seems 2mm is just too thin. When this one is done I might give it to a friend and make another sans kinks.. It will make the frame about 4kgs heavier though

    Also during a test sit, it seemed the man in my model above is a small child. Turns out he is the same height as me, just has size 3 shoes.. and the pipe running from the steering wheel to the front had to have some adjustment to clear my feet

    heres where im at so far

    Also I managed to pick up two Dell PowerEdge 2950 750w power supplies with a bunch of server case fans for $50 Aus delivered.. which was a score

    Photo 8-4-17, 2 33 02 pm.jpg

    Attached Files:

    • Like Like x 4
  9. RandomCoder

    RandomCoder Active Member Gold Contributor

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    I've heard that one way of bending pipe and to avoid kinking is to fill the pipe with sand and cap the ends before bending.
  10. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    updates

    seat and peripherals mounted.. now i need to get a TV.. hopefully have that mounted this arvo after work as i have just got a text from Aus post saying my motors are being delivered today!
    after spending quite a bit of time settling on how i was going to mount the pedals and being quite happy with the result, turns out the centre bolt hole at the front of the G27 pedals is not centred.. i'll leave my tube centred though else it will look like i messed up and make a lil adapter for the pedals to mount up in the centre.

    File 9-4-17, 5 01 35 pm.jpeg
    File 10-4-17, 9 57 49 am.jpeg

    yeah ive heard of that.. but who has the time.. i have games to play.. haha.. my draw bender doesnt normally kink 2.5mm walled pipe.. just think the 2.0 is past the limit
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  11. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    Ok, everything mocked up ready for a cog test tomorrow..

    The motiondynamics motors showed up today.. They're way bigger than I imagined. Kind of intimidating.. I'm not sure why I pictured them smaller. Maybe its all of the talk of wiper motors I kind of had that dimension in mind.

    How heavy is everyones base? The static bit of the sim. I would expect the more weight here the more stable the rig is? Does anyone have the base shimmying around the room on heavy fast movements? I think ill get some heavy wall square tube to make the base frame from
    does anyone fix the base to the floor with dynabolts or similar?

    File 10-4-17, 6 29 29 pm.jpeg File 10-4-17, 6 29 58 pm.jpeg
    • Like Like x 2
  12. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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  13. bodgy

    bodgy Member

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    If you reverse mount the pedals you can probably get more adjustment if that's what you are after. They feel better like that too.

    My test rig is very top heavy and the base is way undersized , it bucks like a bronco if I'm testing and I'm not on it but if I'm sitting on it its planted and doesn't move an inch.
  14. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    thats cool.. after seing them dissaembled it explains the design of seattime's carbon pedals..

  15. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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  16. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    Good evening boys and girls.. It has been a big few days with the easter holidays and I have completed the fabrication.. all I await now is my cables and wiring gear which should hopefully be here during the week, oh and flexi couplings for the hall effect sensors. I already have the Moto monsters and Arduino Uno. Just need power supplys, headers, wires and some big ass silicon wrapped cable to power my motors, its all in the post somewhere between China, Hong Kong, the UK, Darwin (I know right? who thought Darwin would be the local go to for CNC couplings), Melbourne and here (Perth).. stay tuned!

    some details as follows

    IMG_0194.JPG
    frame finished ready to be fully welded

    IMG_0195.JPG Much quicker and more accurate to make 4 brackets at once
    IMG_0196.JPG

    IMG_0198.JPG IMG_0204.JPG IMG_0205.JPG
    motor mockup IMG_0208.JPG push rod fab, cheapo 7/16 rod ends from local speed shop
    IMG_0211.JPG quick rattle can spray job in satin black
    IMG_0220.JPG 180 degree hall effect sensors as recommended by fellow xsim user. brackets made out of 2mm ally and long to give some flex to allow for some eccentricity on shaft (read i didnt drill it very centre)

    IMG_0221.JPG
    solution to the 'centre' bolt holes on the g27 pedals not being centred.. small bracket to offset mounting 12.5mm so it fit my bar mounted centrally IMG_0231.JPG looking good! just needs some motion! IMG_0238.JPG closeup of the motor actuator rods/connections IMG_0241.JPG I toyed around with so many options to fix the arms to the motiondynamics motors.. i ended up just TIG welding them directly to them. (did it in 4 passes waiting around 10 min between each till they were cool to touch so as not to overheat the oil in the gearboxes and bearings) IMG_0243.JPG being a car guy i had plenty of these things lying around. this one i found kicking around left over from a car my brother sold ages ago with no engine as he stole it for his car even longer ago IMG_0244.JPG
    any details you guys are chasing about this please dont hesitate to ask..

    I was surprised how far back the COG was when tested. I guess my lard ass is heavier than I admit to.. getting pretty excited now.. I may or may have not been sitting in her this arvo making car noises while smashing through the 6 speed
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  17. SilentChill

    SilentChill Problem Maker

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    Nice work dude look forward to seeing it in action :)
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  18. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    Slick fabrication work, your rig looks really nice :thumbs

    You have somewhat limited the leverage advantage in where you placed the motors. At least if you find it struggles under load you can move them and the attachment point toward the back, as you have plenty of room.
  19. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    thanks man, appreciate the feedback

    I chose the points based on the range of motion I was trying to achieve. its hard to calculate the force required on a balanced rig to accelerate the given inertia. thought a suck it and see approach was better than pondering what ifs for too long.. can always shift the connection points as you suggest, or shorten the arms on the boxes, (those are free), or worst case, put bigger motors on, change gearbox ratios etc (not so free).. thats the next part of the fun, testing phase..

  20. delcarlo

    delcarlo Member

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    thanks mate, couple of my mates at the shop think i'm mad.. haha.. theyll get on it once they see it doesnt kill me

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